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kittysmitty
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# Posted: 20 Dec 2020 06:27
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Looking for some feedback. Although the cost of solar panels has dropped over the years, there are good deals on used panels that folks have upgraded. I see somewhere around 40 cents a watt. Anyone with experience or advise on used panels., no more than 1000 watts, but more like 500 watts total.Thanks
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Brettny
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# Posted: 20 Dec 2020 07:08
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Cost of the pannels is only one small part of the system. Without knowing any more info no one can say.
Do you have grid power available?
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Steve_S
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# Posted: 20 Dec 2020 09:19
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There are a LOT of Good Used Panels out there that can be had cheap ! But there is also a lot of krap floating around too. Companies like SatanSolar specialise in used panels, they test & guaranty them as well.
https://store.santansolar.com/product-category/solar-panels/
There are other Vendors out there that do the same but I do not know them, I do however know that Santan is very good with people and deliver exactly what they say they will. They make good when things are not right either.
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Nobadays
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# Posted: 20 Dec 2020 09:47
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All of our panels are used. We run 2250 watts for the main cabin and 1000 watts to power the shop. Santan Solar outside of Phoenix specializes in finding, cleaning, testing and reselling used panels. But they carry a lot of different panels some new as well.... prices are great. (Not affiliated but a very satisfied customer. ) Shipping can be spendy if you are only buying a few... well worth it for a bunch.
The 250w panels we use are nearly all at original output... no defects/snail trails and the great part, I can get them for $50.00... and if I'm buying quite a few (I buy extra for trading stock) I often get them for $45.00 each. So 18 - 20 cents a watt. They generally know the history of the panels so mine came from a lot that were 4 years old
The bad news... the 250's I have came from a large PV array that had been hit by a damaging hail storm, insurance company apparently just replaced them all.... many were not damaged at all. However, the labels were required to be removed from the panels, this means no UL sticker so they cannot be used in grid-tie applications, for off-grid, no problem (I discussed this with the electrical inspector, our system is permitted and to code.) The junction boxes on the back of the panels are clearly marked by the manufacturer with model number, etcetera so I know exactly what I have..... this is not true of all the panels, some use a generic junction box. But, Santan Solar does reproduce and place a sticker on each off-grid panel with the specs but no UL compliance sticker.
Again they do carry a lot of panels, different wattage, new and used, many grid-tie applicable.
If I were buying from a private party I would visit them on a sunny day with my volt/ohm meter and check the VOC and the ISC... easy enough to do and will tell you a lot. Check for snail trails... little lines where the backing is separating... the look like snail trails! Check that the panels are in good physical shape, solid, no flex and appear to be handled well.
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Nobadays
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# Posted: 20 Dec 2020 09:49
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Ha ha! Steve... beat me to it! Totally agree! Wasn't sure if I should drop a link...
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SE Ohio
Member
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# Posted: 20 Dec 2020 11:23
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I’d avoid used Harbor Freight panels. Mine are less than 10 years old, 12 volt panels are putting out 4 volts each or so now. Not made to last
SE Ohio
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kittysmitty
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# Posted: 20 Dec 2020 15:41
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Thanks for the feedback. As with any purchase, do your homework. Santan Solar is not an option as I live in Canada and the shipping would cost more than the panels.
Brettny, not sure what having Grid Power available has anything to do with my question.
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gcrank1
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# Posted: 20 Dec 2020 18:50
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Based upon your inquiry of 'worth it' I would also have to factor in having grid power or not, full time or not.
I know folks with grid sometimes think they want to get free of it but knowing what I know now if I had grid power there is no way I would give it up to go solar.
Sans grid there are some things I would do first before trying build a solar-elec system from components not necessarily designed to work together; ie, just because stuff is 'solar' doesnt mean all the bits from different companies work seamlessly and painlessly with each other.
And a proper 'solar friendly site' is way important. If your site isnt right you best know it right away.
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Steve_S
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# Posted: 21 Dec 2020 04:13 - Edited by: Steve_S
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Sadly, we do not have a Santansolar in Canada 
In Ontario there is https://www.solarshoppingmall.com/24V-Solar-Panel_c_25.html
https://solardirectcanada.com/product-category/solar-panels/
These are "okay" but not stellar. There are other vendors that carry used panels and New Old Stock (NOS) but none that I know of as good reliable companies.
I'm OFF-Grid and absolutely love not having Hostage Fees to Hydro-One ! I watch Ontario Hydro get worse, neighbours being blacked out (19 times in 2019) and here I am with the Lights On ! More & more folks up here are installing Solar and on scale to boot... Near Algonquin Park.
Were folks fall over is in the design process. The critical point for us in Canada, is to ensure you have enough solar panel on the Low Winter Sun Hour Days (and today being the 21st, seems apropos that I mention it now)...
Angles & Direction to get maximum solar exposure is critical. Solar Tracking systems can do a marvelous job but they come with a deep cost. Some have panels mounted aimed East, South & West and have things arranged electrically to gain the most sun hours. Others have 3 or 4 position racks which allow you to adjust the panels angles for each season (reasonable cost).
If you really want to go over a planning excercise and get into the details, then I suggest you visit us at https://diysolarforum.com/index.php
BTW: Here is my "About my system" thread. It may be of interest.
https://diysolarforum.com/threads/my-diy-off-grid-cabin-setup-in-ontario-canada-24vdc -120vac.1484/
Hope it helps,
Good Luck
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kittysmitty
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# Posted: 21 Dec 2020 06:12
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I have been using solar at my off grid cabin for 15 years. I know all about solar. My question was in regards to used panels, are they a good deal? As Steve_S has stated we have low sun hours days this time of year and this is when I used the cabin the most. I just want to add panels and trying to decide between new and used. Thanks
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Steve_S
Member
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# Posted: 21 Dec 2020 06:29
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Kitty, there are also NOS Panels & Grade-B (slight blemishes but still 100% good) available and many vendors can get them, if you have a "friendly" that you deal with.
I'm looking at increasing my panel capacity but in my case it also means another Solar Charge Controller and related BOS to inter-connect it all. Ironically, as I have Midnite Classic 200 I'm sorta invested in their "static" tech which does not fully / properly support LiFePO4 battery banks. (I have 910AH of LFP now).
Used Panels can be a great deal if you get them from a reputable reseller. 1/2 price or less depending on model & type.
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Brettny
Member
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# Posted: 21 Dec 2020 08:11 - Edited by: Brettny
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Quoting: kittysmitty I have been using solar at my off grid cabin for 15 years. I know all about solar. My question was in regards to used panels, are they a good deal? As Steve_S has stated we have low sun hours days this time of year and this is when I used the cabin the most. I just want to add panels and trying to decide between new and used. Thanks
With this info yes there worth it. Look up how much there value drops vs how there performance drops. The price drops way quicker. I recently got 940w of pannels for $.31c per watt. These pannels where never installed. The guy had 200 of them. These pannels also match two others I have in watts and volts perfectly.
Theres enough deals out there that If you have time to wait and own a volt meter I wouldnt bother with buying new. All my pannels I bought second hand. They are full sized 37v pannels and I paid less than the original owners paid for the freight charges alone.
I should note that due to shading we actualy get more sun on the pannels when the leaf are down. In summer we get no more than 3hrs. Have you played around with re aiming them or putting them in series/parallel?
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paulz
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# Posted: 21 Dec 2020 08:27 - Edited by: paulz
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Of the 30 used panels I got, I have installed 25. They have all had equal open circuit voltage when I tested them. I saw a chart somewhere showing average degradation over the years, it wasn't a lot, couple percent a year.
Quoting: Steve_S I have Midnite Classic 200 I'm sorta invested in their "static" tech which does not fully / properly support LiFePO4 battery banks.
Steve, I have been trying to fully understand the charging parameters for LiFePO4. Please explain why the Midnite Classic is lacking. My Epever also has no Li option, but it does have a programmable 'User' option.
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Steve_S
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# Posted: 21 Dec 2020 09:27
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Charging LFP is 2-stage CC/CV there is no need for float, no equalisation / desulphation either. Ending Amps for charging is also tricky which is a percentage of actual charging amps.
This is all the info Midnite Provides... I posted it as a set of PDF's. Click the download Button and you'll be presented with downloadable PDFs.
http://www.midniteftp.com/support/kb/faq.php?cid=1
I'm actually in the process of writing "General LiFePO4" basics guide covering cell selection, assembly and related details which also shows voltage curves to SOC and charging info. I'm prepping this for a supplier I use, I'll post a version of it in here as well for folks to use a basic reference.
PS: Those Miady's "RUN"... not worth wasting any time or coin on... and note the 6AH ! Not much use for anything.
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