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MtnDon
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# Posted: 29 Nov 2010 22:03
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Depends what you expect from it and partly what its intended use is. I had one. My opinion is that they shoot shotshells better than the 45LC cartridge, so if the primary load is going to be shotshells, fine. There are shotshell loads that have been specifically created for this gun, and they make a reasonable close range defensive weapon.
The reason it does not shoot 45LC as great (accurate) as it would be with a regular sole purpose 45LC only revolver is the bullet has to jump a distance in the cylinder before contacting the rifling. That affects the accuracy. I have a short barreled 45LC that shoots much smaller groups than the Judge, same length barrel, same ammo, same distance, same shooter.
There are plenty of rave reviews out there and I do not understand why, other than that they are all in magazines that sell ads for their source of revenue. That may just be my opinion though. Taurus sure sells a lot of them. Maybe look for a used one, so it can be resold with little loss.
So back to the beginning: what is the reason for owning the gun?
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Borrego
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# Posted: 29 Nov 2010 22:08
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What is the best small CC .357 out there?
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larry
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# Posted: 29 Nov 2010 22:19
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The reasons for owning a gun are simple and as unique as each owner. My reason is this, so i will not be a victim of....
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MtnDon
Member
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# Posted: 29 Nov 2010 22:35
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Well, this'll start an argument for sure (naming best gun always does)
S&W M&P
Scandium Alloy Frame, 357, 5 shot, 13.3 oz, also available with a laser sight grip
The biggest drawback, to me, is light weight handguns shooting powerful cartridges have noticeable recoil. Some will find the price a drawback too. Can be hard on the hand/wrist. I know, I have a titanium 45LC. They are a joy to pack though.
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toyota_mdt_tech
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# Posted: 29 Nov 2010 22:55
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Ok, added another to my collection! Sig Sauer 556 Classic.
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elkdiebymybow
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# Posted: 26 Jan 2011 02:11
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I always carry when I go into the woods. I feel vulnerable when I do not have a gun on me- not for fear of some wack-o, although it is always nice to be able to defend yourself. I have had so many encounters with bears, mountain lions and now that the wolves are taking over the back country, we have them too. I just think it is smart to be able to bag some food or shoot location rounds off in case of an emergency. Having spent time in the woods when I wish I was packing, I consider a hand gun on par with water bottle, water pump, MRE's, emergency blanket, multiple ways to make fire(especially in rain and snow), extensive first aid/emergency kit and extra clothes. I went two days without food and water and will never be in that position again! I may carry a full pack but one of the last times I was out I saved a buddy who stuck his knife in his arm and cut an artery. It is prudent to be prepared.
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elkdiebymybow
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# Posted: 26 Jan 2011 02:18 - Edited by: elkdiebymybow
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Don,
How does that .454 casull handle? I shot one several years ago and recall one hell of a kick. Among many others, I have a Colt Andaconda, .44 mag with an 6" barrel which shoots quite nicely. I can hit a paper plate at 100 yards too! I'm very impressed with the accuracy. I spend quite a bit of time hunting bear with my bow and always pack my .44 mag but have always wondered if it might be a little light when trying to stop a pissed off bear. My buddy likes the .454 and he also has a .500 which he says is a cannon.
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toyota_mdt_tech
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# Posted: 26 Jan 2011 08:53
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EDBMB, I have the Colt Anaconda also. I have it in the special edition "Real Tree Cammo Hunter" and it has a matching scope. Cool pistol. I have never shot it yet. Have a Ruger Redhawk also, scope rings, but never mounted a scope. Its a smidge longer than the Colt, ie 7 1/4"
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 26 Jan 2011 10:12 - Edited by: MtnDon
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It kicks very hard, very hard indeed. So much so that it is really not something that I would say I look forward to shooting. I only actually fire 454 rounds a couple times a year, just to see if I can still shoot it. Mostly I shoot hot reloaded 45LC or 454 with reduced loads. It's nice too in that I have a rifle that also shoots 454 & 45LC.
The revolver is easier to carry than the rifle and so makes a great tool when hiking, working in bear country. Then it is loaded with genuine 454's.
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MikeOnBike
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# Posted: 26 Jan 2011 13:28
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Quoting: Borrego What is the best small CC .357 out there?
I won't claim it is the best but my mom has a Ruger SP101 and it is very nice to shoot. The slick rounded grip that it came with was fine for .38s but a challenge with .357 loads. I put a Hogue Monogrip on it for her and she is really pleased with it.
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toddheyn
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# Posted: 26 Jan 2011 17:41
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Quoting: MikeOnBike I won't claim it is the best but my mom has a Ruger SP101 and it is very nice to shoot. The slick rounded grip that it came with was fine for .38s but a challenge with .357 loads. I put a Hogue Monogrip on it for her and she is really pleased with it.
I'll second this one. I have the same revolver and also changed out the springs. Now it has a much smoother trigger pull.
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MikeOnBike
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# Posted: 26 Jan 2011 18:22
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When I got my GP100, big brother to the SP101, I took apart the trigger and polished all of the contact surfaces to get rid of any rough machining. I used a dremel with a cotton pad and that super fine red paste. It didn't change the trigger weight or 'file' the trigger but the action is glass smooth. Took about 15 min.
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Borrego
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# Posted: 26 Jan 2011 21:46
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To steer this thread slightly different, I've been thinking lately -
Is it really always better to have a larger caliber? For instance:
the 9mm round has killed plenty of people, but we want the 45 ACP because it has more 'stopping power'. But we're trading off power for accuracy (to some extent), right? Same with .38 spl vs .357....
Comments?
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 26 Jan 2011 22:41
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Choice of firearm depends on whether or not one is concerned mainly with personal defense against other persons, or animals and of what size.
I believe in the largest caliber bullet, combined with powder load, that a person can reliably aim, shoot and hit with. That varies from person to person. So I think the correct answer to caliber/load is that it depends.
Related to stopping power is the type of bullet. Something that will spread out, flatten and deform to transfer its energy to the target is much better than a bullet that will pass through. A hollow point or other expanding bullet is much better for defense than a fully jacketed bullet.
Accuracy: Most personal self defense shooting will occur within 21 feet. Almost anything can be accurate within that range once one knows the weapon. Its a different matter when shooting at longer ranges, but we're talking personal self defense, not general warfare.
So if a person is starting out from scratch it would be good to be able to try out a few different calibers before a purchase. There are some ranges with rentals. Gun clubs may also be able to help. Some people who teach concealed carry courses would be amenable to a private lesson and have enough variety of their own firearms to let one get a feel.
One good thing about a 357 is there is a wide variety of ammo including the 38 that can be used in the firearm, with differing recoil.
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steveqvs
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# Posted: 27 Jan 2011 16:03
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MtnDon
Have you seen S&W is going to make the same M&P gun in a .22
Same size gun. That way you can practice with the cheap 22 ammo and both guns should perform about the same way, feel the same way etc.
s
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 27 Jan 2011 20:44
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I agree with the feel the same way part. But depending on the range of the target the ballistics may be enough to cause a miss if one does not remember.
My son has a Springfield 1911 with a conversion kit to 22LR. It works fine, you can get used to the weight of pistol and all, but there is no comparing the feel when firing and the trajectories of the 22LR and 45ACP are very different. It is still a lot of fun to shoot without spending all the dough for the 45 ammo. Even reloading it adds up, not to mention the time. It can teach proper handling to achieve the best most accurate results, but it is still somewhat like shooting a different gun. The controls are all in the same place; that's good.
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 27 Jan 2011 21:43
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I want to add to, or correct something I just said. While it is true the trajectories are different (22LR and 45 ACP) if one is just practicing for personal dense that won't really make a difference. The distances are very close. I quickly get bored with punching holes in paper at 3 to 7 yards though, so end up shooting longer distances. So, yeah, there may be more utility to having the ability to practise with 22LR on the same firearm type.
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Borrego
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# Posted: 28 Jan 2011 00:50
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Quoting: MtnDon I believe in the largest caliber bullet, combined with powder load, that a person can reliably aim, shoot and hit with. That varies from person to person. So I think the correct answer to caliber/load is that it depends.
Very well said! That's what I was thinking as well. So the 45 ACP is your weapon of choice then? If you had to choose between that or a .357 for a survival gun, which one would it be? I have both and want to go one way or the other. Or maybe both???
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 28 Jan 2011 01:51
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While I very much like the 1911 my favorite general purpose handgun to carry would be one of the pair of Taurus titanium framed double action 45LC that I have. They're not made anymore, but are similar to the lightweight series they have now. A 5 shot cylinder. At 19 ounces, unloaded, they are a pleasure to carry. I use handloaded hollow point 300 grain rounds loaded to provide about 900 ft/sec muzzle out of the short barrel. It's more wham than any off the shelf 45ACP, 45LC or 357 round. It's a big bang, but manageable with practice.
I must admit to a bias towards revolvers over pistols. They are very simple. No safety button to worry about. Just pull the trigger; in double action mode it takes a hard enough pull to make it very difficult to have an "accident". Cock the hammer and use as a single action the pull is very light. If you have to empty it it is very simple and very sure; no rounds left in the chamber in error. Speed loaders make reloading fairly quick. I figure if the five rounds in the cylinder were not enough I was probably somewhere I really should not have been.
So choosing between the 45ACP and 357 would likely have me choosing the 357 because it was a revolver.
All the above is thinking along the lines of personal defense; thinking bad people or animals not including bears, and ranges up to maybe 25 feet. If I'm in the mountains and have real concerns about bears I'd go for my 454 but that is close to 5 pounds loaded. For about the same weight I could carry the Puma lever action rifle.
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cabingal3
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# Posted: 28 Jan 2011 05:45
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Gary O
oh Lordy!
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Gary O
Member
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# Posted: 3 Feb 2011 09:14 - Edited by: Gary O
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Quoting: cabingal3 Gary O oh Lordy!
Woman. You got nuthin' to say.
She's dead set on bagging several bushy tailed rats this summer. I mean these squirrels are as big as cats.
So I got her a squirrel gun for Christmas.
She's gettin' to be a crack shot. Hittin' skinny trees at 30-40 yds on a steady basis.
My southern bride used to eat squirrel when a kid in Southern Louisiana
'M-M-M' she says every time we talk about it.
OK, I'll watch her dine on them, as I eat my porridge.
(Note to self; keep an eye on her while she's cookin' my dinner, could slip in something like a squirrel anus in my soup while I'm unawares)
So, we took ol' Blue with us last trip. A wild hare was the greeting committee. Had to back the little woman down as she was commencing to draw a bead.........
However, she's becoming a crack shot with her Crossman 760, and building up her arm in pumping it up five times. I figure if she gets up to eight or ten pumps then she'll be a worthy toter on the other end of the bigger beams we'll be hauling.
And, I s/be the proud owner of a couple squirrel skin caps pretty soon. Her southern Texas sis told her to save the testicles for cap ornaments. I don't know about these southern gals....kinda scary at times. Could start a new trend though. Maybe have them hanging on my rear view mirror in the Jeep...call 'em tassticles.
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Jerry
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# Posted: 3 Feb 2011 09:36
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Just to chime in - my preferences are a 9mm for CC and a 4" 357 for every day woods carry. The 9mm gives me 17 rounds in a semiauto, but the bigger reason is that I just like to shoot it, therefore I'm more comfortable and confident with it. Also the ammo is cheaper allowing me to shoot more.
The 357 I carry is a 4" 586 S&W. I own 44mag revolvers, but for the same reasons as above the 357 seems right for me for woods carry. I would however carry my 44mag if I were specifically bear hunting.
Whatever you carry, shoot it alot so it becomes like an old friend. Somehow friends always take care of friends.
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Audiophile
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# Posted: 12 Feb 2018 21:53
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Thank you everyone for your input, especially MtnDon. This site is full of great info and pics. I plan to start a thread with my build pics and deck construction pics this summer. I have had my cabin now for almost two years. The only thing I really don't like about the cabin life is the feeling of a lack of security at the property. My nearest neighbors are about 2 miles away and they are very nice people but I doubt they want to get in front of me and a bear or mountain lion! 
So my plan is to get a couple cans of bear spray and a .22 pistol for this summer. For usage I plan for 95% target shooting/piece of mind and 5% bear/mountain lion/people protection - hopefully it is zero percent! I know... I know, a .22 is not going to stop a bear alone - at least not one shot. But a blast of bear spray fog coupled with a .22 shot (if the bear is stupid enough to keep coming) should make him/her get the message!
So I have shot .22 pistols years ago and I like them but what are your recommendations? Also, since this will be my first firearm purchase what do recommend for securing the firearm at home and what is the best beginner training? Any recommendations for a backstop for target shooting?
Thanks for helping this newbie out!
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toyota_mdt_tech
Member
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# Posted: 12 Feb 2018 22:21
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Quoting: Borrego .357 out there?
I have a S&W model 66 (stainless med frame in .357) and a model 686, same thing but large frame. 66 is in 3 " barrel and 686, a 4" barrel.
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ILFE
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# Posted: 13 Feb 2018 00:41
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Quoting: Audiophile I know... I know, a .22 is not going to stop a bear alone - at least not one shot.
You shoot a bear with a .22, and ALL you are going to accomplish is pissing it off.
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Gary O
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# Posted: 13 Feb 2018 01:44
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Quoting: toyota_mdt_tech I have a S&W model 66 (stainless med frame in .357) and a model 686, same thing but large frame. 66 is in 3 " barrel and 686, a 4" barrel.
My go to has become the GP-100 357
...ever since I shot my favorite chair while clearing the chamber of my semi-auto
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ILFE
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# Posted: 13 Feb 2018 03:05
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Quoting: Gary O ...ever since I shot my favorite chair while clearing the chamber of my semi-auto
Not to mention, "wheel" guns don't jam.
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Gary O
Member
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# Posted: 13 Feb 2018 08:57
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Quoting: ILFE Not to mention, "wheel" guns don't jam
'tis a blessing
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Malamute
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# Posted: 15 Feb 2018 17:41
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Quoting: ILFE Not to mention, "wheel" guns don't jam.
Well, actually, they do, but in different ways.
I prefer them in general, but would not attempt to make a blanket statement that they are perfect, never fail to function for any reason etc. I believe Tom Givens mentioned that in average revolver classes he does, they have several fail to function in some way. Not large classes, and not cheapo guns for the most part. Ive had few functional issues, but have had a couple.
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ILFE
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# Posted: 15 Feb 2018 19:41
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Quoting: Malamute Well, actually, they do, but in different ways.
I stand corrected. I should have stated, in my lifetime, I have never had a revolver to jam. Can count misfires on one hand. Revolver to semi-auto gun ownership would be a ten to one ratio. Speed loaders certainly have helped, as well.
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