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UltraViolet
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# Posted: 24 Jun 2011 00:58
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We're searching for non-electric solutions to cool our off-grid cabin in the summer.
Our cordwood walls keep the inside about 10 degrees cooler than the outside air. But the humidity in Kentucky is what really makes you miserable.
We tried Earth Tubes, but they don't work in high humidity. They just blow moist, moldy air. Earth Tubes are only an arid climate solution.
Solar/battery room fans just kinda blow the stickiness around.
Planted a bunch of trees, but they're still too young to provide any shade.
Sure would love to hear some other suggestions - it's getting hot out here!!
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 24 Jun 2011 01:35
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If it wasn't built yet, 10 foot ceilings. I've been told that was one reason the grand old southern homes all had very tall ceilings.
How off grid is off grid? There are split mini systems (A/C) that are now available with efficiencies in the 20+ SEER range. I know someone in southern CA who runs one with all power supplied by PV modules.
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smitty
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# Posted: 24 Jun 2011 04:57
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Do they make propane AC's?
Was just a thought.
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Rob_O
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# Posted: 24 Jun 2011 08:52
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Quoting: smitty Do they make propane AC's?
Kinda. I've seen a historic home that had a cupola with a gas burner inside to help create a draft on days with no good cooling breezes.
I want to say it was Monticello, but can't find that detail on their website
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Just
Member
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# Posted: 24 Jun 2011 09:03
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what about geothermal still needs power but not much..or earth tube to a small air to air unit
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Just
Member
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# Posted: 24 Jun 2011 09:10
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or ,a automotive unit matched to a honda engine
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Scott_T
Member
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# Posted: 24 Jun 2011 11:23
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UltraViolet - is the cabin insulated? (R13 walls and R25 in the attic/ceiling at a minimum).
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Scott_T
Member
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# Posted: 24 Jun 2011 11:30
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Insulation won't help with the damp, muggy feeling but would further reduce the thermal radiation. A ceiling fan has pretty low energy demand and could be run off a 'smallish' PV array to move the air around.
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rayyy
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# Posted: 26 Jun 2011 05:47
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I have thought about the same thing.I dread those hot,muggy nights trying to sleep.Bout the only thing I can come up with is to put in a small window a/c and run it off the generator.If the room is small and well insulated,maybe I can get through the night comfortably.
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mgc
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# Posted: 26 Jun 2011 17:07
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Our cabin solution was to insulate walls and roof, put in a small window unit and generator. It gets very hot, damp and still at night but set on med. setting, it freezes us out and is able to run all night. Not very eco-friendly but makes for very good sleeping. Other wise MtnDon is correct, in the south before A/C we used 10 or 12 foot ceilings, transoms over doors and very tall windows, gets the worst heat up high and promotes circulation. That was eco-friendly, but I still remember it being sticky and hot. Then we got an attick fan, like A/C for us, but sometimes it was still hot and sticky. If your cabin is completed, I would suggest the A/C, generator set up, it will be much more confortable.
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mgc
Member
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# Posted: 26 Jun 2011 17:09
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Sorry, I didn't check the spelling.
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turkeyhunter
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# Posted: 26 Jun 2011 18:55
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here in the south, now days it's so hot..............not like it was growing up here . I have to have a/c to sleep here at night.
I would spring for a BIG generator and window a/c's.....get new ones that are better on elect than the old ones. And new ones are cheap nowdays. I plan on using 2 motel units (new) with heat strips for heat and a/c is18000 BTU's one for loft and one for downstairs.
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grinnil
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# Posted: 28 Jun 2011 18:40
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i live in a 8 by 22 foot cabin in arkansas. i use a 10000 btu window unit in the evening to get it cooled off then use two twelve volt fans runnin off a couple marine batteries. if it gets too hot i keep a wet towel across my chest. eventually it gets cold. been thinkin about solar panels
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turkeyhunter
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# Posted: 28 Jun 2011 21:37
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Quoting: grinnil been thinkin about solar panels
or a generator!!!!!!!!!
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grinnil
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# Posted: 29 Jun 2011 09:12
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have a 5000 watt generator i can only afford to run it 4 hours a day
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 29 Jun 2011 15:21
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IMO, generators not not a solution to off grid power. They are a crutch, a means of obtaining temporary electrical power. Gasoline, propane, diesel are all not going to get any cheaper in the future.
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Borrego
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# Posted: 29 Jun 2011 16:34
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Solar panels should power a small window a/c unit. And there are swamp coolers for those of us in dryer climates..... very small draw amp wise.
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Brknarow
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# Posted: 1 Jul 2011 07:39
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I've been looking at this for a while now, but it takes a lot of solar panels. http://www.solarpanelsplus.com/dc-air-conditioning/.
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ogob
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# Posted: 28 Jul 2011 15:37
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This is my second summer offgrid in Alabama. My first year, I he-manned it and was totally miserable only having a small 4 inch battery powered fan. This year is much better. For my solution I needed something cheap but workable. This eliminated the generator as I consider that as specific use and backup only (e.g. Skill saw or sunless day). I get about 6 hours of run time per gal of gas and it's $3.54 per gal - that's about $450 per month to run all day. Being offgrid-onabudget (ogob) that just wouldn't work. I ended up getting the 45 watt solar kit from Harbor Freight, a 75 amp hour marine battery from Walmart, and two O2 Cool 10" 12 volt fans. The rest is acclimization, trees, and gratitude. Yesterday was a 97 degree 90% humidity day, and while a bit warm in the afternoon it was ok. After last year though maybe my expectations are a little lower.
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larryh
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# Posted: 28 Jul 2011 20:17
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After a home is built its a catch up of reasonable options. Like 12 volt ceiling fans, or 12 volt table fans. As was mentioned the old timers rather knew that high ceilings were a plus in hot weather. Tall windows that open at the top are a big help to keep the hotter air moving out. Shade on the house if you can help it. Plus in the old days a screened in sleeping porch was a place to get cooler in the night air. I have an old farm home and this relentless summer has been worse than usual. But I run fans which help keep me cool, although I am not off gird. I am capable of 12v operation from a deep cycle battery if I wish, but normally I only use it in power failures. A window fan which was how people cooled at night years ago is a good idea as well, uses much less power than an air conditioner, but if you close most of the windows and open the one that can blow over the bed it makes nights bearable. The amish produce some large type 12 volt fans that are made like regular new fans and not like the toys you get from solar places made in china. But they use much more amps and so it takes a fully charged battery to operate them for most of the night or a couple at most. A menonite near me has a solar panel he charges his battery with by day and it runs the fans at night in the bed rooms.
Larry
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Bigdtown
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# Posted: 10 Jan 2012 04:29
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an idea we are going to try this coming summer is to open the house up at night and run box fans in the open windows to pull in all of the cool night air and then in the morning when we wake up we will close the windows, turn off the fans and run the dehumidifier. All of this will be off of our solar panels and battery bank. I'll let you know how it goes. By the way if you anyone is thinking of running a window A/C unit off of solar panels and a battery bank they are gonna need at least a 5,000 watt inverter and one hell of a battery bank not to mention plenty of panels with plenty of sun. If anyone actually does this please let me know so I can pick yur brain.
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Martian
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# Posted: 10 Jan 2012 08:26
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If one is going to live off the grid down South (I grew up in SE Texas and have lived all across the very humid Gulf Coast without AC) then you have to build like they did before AC. That means tall ceilings, lots of double-hung windows, and no insulation. Insulation works against you in the South. It gets hot during the day and stays hot all night. With no insulation, your cabin will cool down when the sun goes down. Yes, it will cost a bit more to heat it in the Winter, but if you have a good woodstove, you'll be warm. Besides, Winter doesn't last as long down South, but Summer seems to go on forever!
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Bob in AR
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# Posted: 24 Jan 2012 14:37
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martian, thx for your post. i am new to AR Ozarks, and starting to plan an off-grid low-budget cabin, very small. i am trying to re-think everything, including insulation. i would really like to figure out how to include thermal mass and passive ventilation into design. i now understand why a cabin i've seen had such high ceiling, which seems crazy to try to heat in winter: it's for the summer heat the owner was planning. i think i am going to first put up a tent platform on cinder blocks temporarily filled with clay, and spend progressively longer periods on the land before i decide what to do. all ideas welcomed, thanks for this site. Bob in AR
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ranchboss
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# Posted: 27 Jan 2012 08:23
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smitty
yes I'm sure I saw on the net but they are big bucks.
But we have a propane generator it an old cast iron onan low rpm but it will drink some fuel. I am building a gasifier so it will run on wood gas that way I can run both acs, we have about 300 watt of solar and 340 ah of battery and that works well for lights and tv, charging cell phones and drill batt. but won't cut it for ac. I saw on one site that a guy uses the solar for his freezer makes a block of ice 18in square and buts a fan in front or back and says it cools his whole cabin he didn't say how big of cabin.
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ranchboss
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# Posted: 27 Jan 2012 08:30
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Martian
I new there was a reason I didn't want to insulate but the wife spoke so it got insulated, but the high ceiling do work great in the summer not to good in winter it is tough to heat all that air up there.
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 27 Jan 2012 10:25 - Edited by: MtnDon
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People used to build uninsulated homes all over the place. My parents home on the frozen prairies of Canada was 2x4 framed and built about 1910. The wall cavities were empty, though there was tar paper under the siding. So it does not surprise me to hear that the same practices were followed 1500 miles south. I'm not sure that means it was a good idea then or now.
Tall ceilings, yes. Second floors with large stairwells to help hot air rise and exit out windows at the top. One reason turrets became popular in many places was to create a chimney effect to draw cooler air in at the bottom. Where is was not too humid people would hang wet sheets over the lower window openings. Today many still use evaporative coolers. Plant trees around the house for shade and the cooling effect they can create.
Insulation keeps the heat out too. Combine that with opening windows, creating ventilation paths for the cool night air. Humidity is the bugbear.
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Off_grid_hunter
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# Posted: 27 Jan 2012 15:13
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I have a few 12 volt fans that I run from my Solar Panel Array.
Doesn't do much good when the humidity hits 100 but it does help, my cabin is pretty basic with a peaked roof with vents that can be opened and closed. Now that helps with getting a nice draft through the place in conjunction with the fans it stays pretty comfy year round.
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neb
Member
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# Posted: 29 Jan 2012 08:32
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I do feel for you people that have to deal with the heat. What about going under ground with a living area basement. Things would be cooler in the ground.
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neb
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# Posted: 29 Jan 2012 13:36
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Quoting: MtnDon Insulation keeps the heat out too. Combine that with opening windows, creating ventilation paths for the cool night air. Humidity is the bugbear.
I agree Don, that a very well insulated home will keep heat out of the home.
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Stophel
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# Posted: 16 Feb 2012 16:27
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I wonder if there are any types of non-electric dehumidifying setups, like with those "do not eat" slica gel things? Probably would be impossible to make work on such a large scale, though...
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