|
| Author |
Message |
DRP
Member
|
# Posted: 10 Oct 2025 10:26pm
Reply
I've been working on building an apartment in what was the balcony of the old theater in town. We had termite Tuesday a few months ago in the main floor framing.. a floor below where I want to be spending money. I got everything cut back and cleaned up, then soaked all the floor framing under there with a borate solution before sistering new full length treated joists alongside the compromised ones.
It is low/non toxic to mammals but it disrupts the gut of wood eating insects (that was careful wording, things like carpenter bees aren't ingesting the wood, they are just excavating). Borate also stops decay fungi. Old carpenters would sprinkle borax on the bottom plate before closing up walls to deter insects. Chemically the borate treatment now can be made by mixing borax and boric acid with hot water. That is essentially what TimBor is. The other way, which is what I do is to buy wettable boron powder at the ag supply, Solubor or equivalent. It is chemically the same as TimBor. I mix 1 lb/gallon of water. A drop or two of Dawn can help it stick and wet out the surface.
The past couple of days I've finished off the 50 lb bag and sprayed the framing in the apartment, both the old rafters and the new walls, dropped ceilings, etc, prior to insulation. I like to do this in old buildings especially, if there might be bugs in the old wood, don't bring fresh food without doing something about the critters. There is sure nothing wrong with doing it before buttoning up new framing.
In a couple of rafters I saw signs of what I think was a Death Watch beetle. It's one of the few that can survive in dry softwood. The water torture like ticking of their slow chewing on a quiet night led to their name.
Well, thinking more, not all insect that it kills have to be wood eaters. The borate roach powders work when they are grooming themselves... so their habits can also play a part. Terro ant bait is borate in a sugar syrup.
Anyway, I had ~$100 in that bag, I'm sure its gone up but still pretty cheap insurance.
|
|
Brettny
Member
|
# Posted: 11 Oct 2025 08:00am
Reply
I had ants in my newly built cabin. Tried the borate and sugar trick and it didnt work. Terro did but I also sprayed with some big box store ant spray outside.
Did you find much rodent activity?
I have a small cottage on my property that pre 1930. The time came to gut it and I found a bees nest or a mouse nest in every single stud bay. All but one Hornets nest was empty.
|
|
DRP
Member
|
# Posted: 11 Oct 2025 09:33am
Reply
A very little bit, there were a few nests in the concealed triangle under the balcony seating but really not much. I always wonder what old "cides" we are working around. I know the chloridane smell all too well. I think it has been gone for 50 years but we got into some around a rotten sill a couple of years ago, smells kick off memory and it sure does.
The building design is from the old highly flammable nitrocellulose film days, rusty sprinkler piping everywhere. I was on a ladder with the portaband on the out side of the building, removing one of the outdoor lines. It had frozen at some point and all the sprinkler heads had popped. I sawed through the first stick, letting it drop to the ground. As it fell and cleared the fresh cut end of the pipe I was looking at a pipe packed with years worth of wasp nests. I was much relieved that none were active!
We had the roof redone a few weeks ago, adding 5" of foam over the top. The lower end bay of the roof was completely rotten, 2 big dumpsters worth of mostly compost. Earlier a beekeeper had removed a large hive and 50 lbs of honey in the ceiling. There were squirrel nests, bird feathers and stuff I'd rather not remember too clearly packed in that section. The original insulation was 2" thick layered crepe paper widely stitched along each side and stapled in the rafter bays, from Kimberly Clark co, they were around back then.
On baiting ants, they seem to be either sweet loving or grease loving. Carpenter ants don't ingest wood, they are nesting, usually in damp wood. They will eat sweets especially aphid honeydew but seem to prefer protein (even a tasty termite). They can be a real problem early on when building. The wood is wet, the building is wet. A few scouts find your piles and all of a sudden the colony is chewing on the framing. That mess calms down once the building dries out. We are well inside the woods. Each spring/summer we will have scouts come through, then the sweet loving little pith ants, a few acrobat ants (the grease lovers with their tail in the air). For some of them it might take different bait or a mix of flavors to get them to take the bait to the nest. Sprays take out the ones you see on contact but leave the nest intact. I'll do that in the building if they are nesting in my piles. Open up the pile and drop the hammer. Short of that baiting is better for removing them... but often simply drying out will do the trick.
|
|
Brettny
Member
|
# Posted: 12 Oct 2025 07:16am
Reply
I have seen carpenter ants also nest in foam. One small fiberglass sail boat I had with a foam block inside was infested.
|
|
DRP
Member
|
# Posted: 12 Oct 2025 08:15am
Reply
They did that in our motorhome. There was an article in a trade mag years ago saying that in closed cell foam their respiration will condense on the foam, run down to collect in pools, and they have water in their nest, all the comforts of home.
Never used it but there is borated foam board, looks like EPS tho;
https://crawlspacedepot.com/bora-foam-4-x-8-x-2-1-2-insulation-board/
|
|
itsadamnshame
Member
|
# Posted: 12 Oct 2025 08:18am - Edited by: itsadamnshame
Reply
I used Bora care on some saw mill lumber for powder post beetles. It penetrates deep into the wood. Carpenter bees don't like it either. I'm going to use the diy borate mix next time. Bora care is very expensive.
Ant treatment. Spray 1 ft. up and 1 ft. out on your exterior foundation with fipronil. Exterior treatment only with this product. Termidor SC or generic brand Taurus Sc. Amazing results.
|
|
DRP
Member
|
# Posted: 12 Oct 2025 12:40pm
Reply
The homemade version of BoraCare is to replace up to 50% of the water in the mix above with ethylene glycol, regular antifreeze. Another brand uses propylene glycol, RV antifreeze which is non toxic. Glycol is much slower drying than water, borate only moves in wood that is above the fiber saturation point. Glycol is good at making dry wood "wet" for longer and deeper. Which one is not critical in that role. The borate goes along for the ride.
I was restoring a log cabin in town that was being eaten up. We replaced the floor and lower several rows. I kept the rest wet with borate for a month with twice daily sprays. By the end of the job there were only a few active holes that we hit with borate and a powderpost hole sized vet syringe.
|
|
|
