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gumbo2go
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# Posted: 21 Mar 2014 14:15
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I'm planning on building a 1,200 sf cabin in SW Montana and we are considering placing (2) 750 gal. rainwater tanks in the basement. Do you think that moisture or humidity will be an issue indoors?
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Just
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# Posted: 21 Mar 2014 14:58
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Moisture or humidity should be ok . What about freezing ???
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gumbo2go
Member
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# Posted: 21 Mar 2014 15:32
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I'm planning on insulating the room pretty well as well as wrapping the tanks in foil bubble wrap insulation. I could possibly add some sort of heating cable or pad to the tank is things get too cold. I will also have propane to add to the heating of the room if needed. One wall will be totally earth sheltered.
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Just
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# Posted: 21 Mar 2014 16:22
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not sure about your climate . in Canada they would freeze without heat . if you are not there much in the winter it could be a big worry .
We never use our cottage in the winter any more ,to old to carry wood !
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gumbo2go
Member
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# Posted: 21 Mar 2014 17:12
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it worrys me too.
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BaconCreek
Member
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# Posted: 21 Mar 2014 21:00
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We have 2 five gal plastic water containers we were keeping at our cabin in central KY. This winter we noticed there was a great deal of condensation on both of these when the weather got cold in November. One was an insulated jug and one was not. It didn't seem to make a difference.
We took one home and kept the other in an open cooler while we are gone during the week. This keeps the moisture off the floor. The cabin is off grid and it gets super cold while we are gone. Hope you can get your water supply to work for you.
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gumbo2go
Member
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# Posted: 21 Mar 2014 21:39
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Thanks for the info. That's what I'm afraid of ... getting too much condensation running down the tank walls.
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old243
Member
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# Posted: 21 Mar 2014 22:13
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Could you locate the tanks near a floor drain . You might also want a drain close by in case the tanks overflow. You will also likely have to drain them , ocasionally. We had a cistern in our basement at one time, The water would get stale and we would have to drain it. The basement air is probably moist, causing the water to condense on the tank. Probably if the basement is well sealed up freezing below grade , won't be a problem. Old243
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 21 Mar 2014 22:26
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When and if the temperature of the tank surface reaches the dew point there will be condensation. That will happen with any hard non porous surface and even on porous wood at times where it will likely manifest itself as frost rather than liquid water.
Insulation may help but remember insulation only slows down the rate of heat loss from the warmer object to the colder object. If the tank of water sits long enough at or below freezing the water will freeze.
If part of the basement backs into a hillside, or is deep enough there will be some heat from the earth. Lots of variables enter into this but that could help if there was insulation between the tank and the rest of the open basement. That could help trap the earth heat.
Is this a full time residence cabin? Or is this going to sit unused or mostly unused during a long and cold MT winter?
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bldginsp
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# Posted: 22 Mar 2014 11:41
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If you are cutting into the earth to make a basement, perhaps you could instal heat pump coils in the earth below the frost line. These could circulate water in pipes around, or in, the tanks to prevent freezing. But, requires electricity to operate a recirc pump and timer.
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gumbo2go
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# Posted: 24 Mar 2014 12:13
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The cabin will be part time mainly during the warm months between June thru Oct.
Solar powered so electricity would be available along with some type of timer that could activate a pump to recirculate the tanks with warmer water during the dead of winter?
thanks for the ideas
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bldginsp
Member
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# Posted: 24 Mar 2014 14:19
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The idea is not to recirculate the water in the tanks, but to circulate water through a loop pipe that goes underground where the earth is warmer. The loop pipe would transfer heat to the water in the tanks by wrapping the loop,around the outside of the tank, or perhaps by running the pipe inside the tank. But it wouldn't remove or replenish water in the tank, if that's what you thought.
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gumbo2go
Member
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# Posted: 24 Mar 2014 21:38
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Yes, I know there are a few options for getting warmer water to the storage tanks. Maybe I could incorporate a tankless propane water heater to do the job?
Not that I need to heat my storage tanks, just keep the temp above freezing so that I don't get a frozen water storage tank or cracking of the shell!
The tank will be plastic so there would be a limit as to how hot the inlet connection could be.
thanks,
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old243
Member
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# Posted: 24 Mar 2014 22:11
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If you don't use the cabin much after October . You might be best to drain the water in the fall .Or at least one. this would eliminate the problem . Spring rains would likely fill them up again . Just a thought. old 243
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MtnDon
Member
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# Posted: 24 Mar 2014 22:55
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As much as I don't like it we gave up on the idea of carrying over collected water through the winter because of the problems associated with storage in sub freezing temperatures. It's really too bad as in a normal winter there is enough snow that will collect on the roof and then melt on sunny days. Lots of water goes to waste. 
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gumbo2go
Member
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# Posted: 25 Mar 2014 12:21
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Yes I agree,
there would be quite a bit of snow melt thru the winter freezing and thawing cycles. Plus, by the time I could get up to the cabin in the spring I feel that I'd miss a good portion of the spring rains. During the middle of the summer it is dry as a bone! Spring will be my time to collect water. Otherwise, I would just forget about storing water during winter and drain the tanks until May.
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