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paulz
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# Posted: 2 Nov 2021 11:48 - Edited by: paulz
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As I mentioned in another thread, the thought occurred to me to use a storage tank under the sink for hot water. So I tested the idea using a car radiator overflow tank. Like a hot water heater, the inlet runs to the bottom of the tank, the outlet at the top.
The plan being that, to fill the coffee pot or otherwise use cold water, use the hot valve, which fills the tank with hot water while the cold is filling the coffee pot. Then when hot water is needed it's at the ready, no waiting or wasting water.
Well it seems to work, although a larger, well insulated tank would be needed, something that might stay at least warm most of the day. Not really sure it's going to be beneficial in the long run, just something to try inside out of the rain we're finally getting.
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gcrank1
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# Posted: 3 Nov 2021 12:23
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Build a box or use some kind of can or bucket around your tank and surround it with spray foam from a diy can?
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paulz
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# Posted: 3 Nov 2021 20:08 - Edited by: paulz
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Good idea. I'm still not sold on this idea. It seems to work...
What little I've learned about tank water heaters is they fill with cold water from the bottom and the hot water comes out the top, which is how my little tank is but I'm not sure it's working that well, since it only holds about a quart and will fill and empty quickly. The water may be mixing up too quickly. A bigger tank might work better. Ultimately a coil of metal tubing instead but it would take a lot of it to make up a quart or two.
Still thinking a 6 gallon RV heater may be the ticket. I could put on the wall right outside of the sink with only a couple feet of pipe.
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ICC
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# Posted: 3 Nov 2021 20:42 - Edited by: ICC
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I think this will do more to save on hauling water but the volume is too small and poorly insulated to hold heat for any length of time. If you start with an empty tank in the AM and run water into the tank until warm flows a lot of that heat goes into raising the temperature of the tank. So that quart or so of water gets cooled during the save.
Suburban makes a 4 gallon heater as well as 6, 10, 12 and 16 gallon versions.
I think we had a topic on recycling the water from the hot line back to storage quite some time ago, but there was something that didn't work well for your etup. But I still think that is a better way to save water use; save the heated water for later use.
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paulz
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# Posted: 4 Nov 2021 09:48 - Edited by: paulz
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Yes, as I said this was only a test, since I had the overflow bottle from a car. So I didn't insulate it. The bottle did stay hot to the touch for for a couple of hours, as did the water inside. And I saved all the water it took to get it hot.
My thermos, about the same size, keeps water hot overnight easily. A half gallon thermos, with a modified top for inlet and outlet pipes, might work, if it could handle the pressure.
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paulz
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# Posted: 4 Nov 2021 10:45 - Edited by: paulz
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ICC, I just went over your experience with the 6 gallon RV heaters, as my sink tank idea does nothing for the inconsistent showering with the tankless heater. Still hard for me to believe, with all the tankless heaters in homes, that everyone fights this issue. And I'm still trying various settings on it...
The only ongoing downside I can see is the extra LP cost of heating water that may not get used. As I remember from my motorhome, it furnished just enough hot water for a decent shower. Might be a factor for me, since I have to haul my tanks back and forth for filling. Might not, depending on how wisely it's used.
Another possibility would be a 6 gallon tank inline, filled with the tankless heater prior to showering. Hmm..
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ICC
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# Posted: 4 Nov 2021 13:26
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Quoting: paulz Still hard for me to believe, with all the tankless heaters in homes, that everyone fights this issue. And I'm still trying various settings on it...
The quality of on-demand water heaters that are used in full-time use homes or recreational properties that are more upscale than most many of the cabins on this forum are very good units that have few problems. For the most part the assorted issues some folks here have with on-demand water heaters are occurring with the low cost type. There is a difference.
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snobdds
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# Posted: 4 Nov 2021 16:57
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This thread reminds me of a saying my dad always said...
it's too expensive to be cheap.
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paulz
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# Posted: 4 Nov 2021 17:11
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Quoting: snobdds This thread reminds me of a saying my dad always said... it's too expensive to be cheap.
Tell us then, what water heater do you use in your cabin?
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snobdds
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# Posted: 5 Nov 2021 01:01
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Marey 3.1 gpm propane with battery ignition.
It's not even that expensive.
Spend the time and money to do plumbing or electrical once. It's cheaper in the long run.
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paulz
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# Posted: 5 Nov 2021 08:37 - Edited by: paulz
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Quoting: snobdds Marey 3.1 gpm propane with battery ignition. It's not even that expensive. Spend the time and money to do plumbing or electrical once. It's cheaper in the long run.
Very fist review I read on that heater.
Hot water.. better than nothing!
It does do hot water, so it's better than nothing.. not a steady hot like home, using it at an off-the-grid cabin for kitchen sink and outdoor shower. Constantly having to adjust it and turning it on/off to get it going again. Will not put this in our permanent shower in the cabin that's for sure. Will buy something more consistent even if generator has to be used.
https://tinyurl.com/hbdukh35
Sounds like it's no different, better nor expensive than the Ecotemps, also battery ignition, so electrical has nothing to do with it.
The only way to improve on my plumbing with one of these heaters is to move it directly opposite the sink, eliminating maybe 8 feet of 1/2" pipe. But that adds 8' to get over to the shower. Saves a little water getting hot to the sink but does nothing for the issue described in the review above.
I could hire a professional plumber to do that, cost is no object, but I can handle it, I did the plumbing I have now (along with building the cabin, every stick). Time isn't an issue, I'm retired, these are things I enjoy playing around with.
When we were spending a day or two a week at the cabin it wasn't that big an issue but we are just about living here now, so these small idiosyncrasies have become more important. Like many on here, getting water to the cabin isn't as simple as turning on the spigot and paying the monthly water bill.
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snobdds
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# Posted: 5 Nov 2021 12:24
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I wouldn't hang your hat on one review. My review would be exactly the opposite...so where does that leave you?
Plumbing is not fun or easy and therefore a long term solution should be envisioned, even if it means a little more work.
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