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buckybuck
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# Posted: 29 Nov 2012 19:47
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I'm interested in recommendations for a good battery charger. Here's what I'm looking for:
1. A battery charger to top off a 12 volt deep cycle battery or two in a reasonable amount of time. I know there's such a thing as too many amps when charging batteries, but does that really apply with today's "smart" battery chargers?
2. A battery charger that plays nice with a generator. I've got a "dirty" 3500 Watt generator, and a "clean" 1600 Watt Inverter Generator. I'd like a battery charger that I can use with either type of generator.
And finally, I am a small cabin-type person. Price is a consideration.
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MtnDon
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# Posted: 29 Nov 2012 20:19
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Maximum amps into the battery should be limited to C/8 to C/10, where C = the amp hour capacity of the battery or batteries that are connected. A smart 3 stage charger will start at the maximum in what's called bulk charge, then switch to absorb and finish in float.
So the place to start is to check the amp-hours and do the division.
Iota Engineering makes an assortment of sizes of chargers that are great units. I've used them. I can't vouch for them working on a dirty gen output but they work fine on an inverter generator.
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TomChum
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# Posted: 29 Nov 2012 21:00
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Sears has an economical 40A "smart charger", requires about 700watts @ full 40, but i never saw mine put out a full 40. I can't say whether the 3500w generator will run it, but how dirty can a generator be?
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toyota_mdt_tech
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# Posted: 30 Nov 2012 09:03
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Any battery charger will be "dirty" as its only 2 phase phase, half wave rectified which just typically makes for a heavy pulsating DC. If you want a nice charger (clean) uses more phases and full wave rectification, they make charger/power supplies for trailers. I have an enclosed trailer I have loaded up to sleep in, ie furnace, AC, and installed an Intelli-Charger 9100 and added the "smart wizard" which does just as Mt Don mentioned, it wil charge it at a high rate, then taper off, then drop way back to float (13.5 volts or so) and once every 4 days for only 15 minutes, hits it hard with 14.8 volts to keep and or knock off any sulphation which can kill a battery also. Mine was 60 amps, but they come in 30-100 amps and prices accordingly. I think I paid $200 for mine years ago, price has went way up. Got mine from camping world.
These are designed to be a charger and a power supply plus a battery maintainer.
A battery charger only will not be "clean"
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TheCabinCalls
Member
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# Posted: 30 Nov 2012 10:26
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So are the Battery Tender trickle chargers I use for boat and car batteries not good to use?
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MtnDon
Member
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# Posted: 30 Nov 2012 10:53 - Edited by: MtnDon
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Quoting: TheCabinCalls So are the Battery Tender trickle chargers I use for boat and car batteries not good to use?
Depends on what/how they are being used. And I'm not familiar with that brand.
Many "trickle chargers" do a good job at the job they were designed for. That is, maintaining a battery charge as it sits idle. They are not meant to recharge a depleted battery. They are supposed to supply a low current at a voltage just high enough to keep the battery fully charged and without causing excessive water loss. Some I have seen don't do that well, their voltage fluctuates too much. If the voltage goes too high water loss occurs. Too low a voltage is not good either.
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MtnDon
Member
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# Posted: 30 Nov 2012 12:39
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I meant to add that proper float voltage is 13.6 for a 12 volt battery. If you have a digital meter check yours.
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buckybuck
Member
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# Posted: 30 Nov 2012 17:03
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Quoting: MtnDon Iota Engineering makes an assortment of sizes of chargers that are great units. I've used them. I can't vouch for them working on a dirty gen output but they work fine on an inverter generator.
I'm glad you mentioned that, because I talked to a guy who's willing to sell me a used IOTA DLS-45. But this is how little I know about these things. These are meant to be used in RVs as a replacement for whatever device RV manufacturers use to drop voltage down to 12 volts for the 12 volt lights, etc., as well as to charge the RV battery, right? So you can also use them as a standalone battery charger?
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toyota_mdt_tech
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# Posted: 30 Nov 2012 17:07
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Quoting: buckybuck So you can also use them as a standalone battery charger?
Yes, this is the ultimate. Its not only a 12V power supply, its a charger/maintainer. This is much better than a typical noisy battery charger if you want a cleaner DC. If its a sweet deal, swoop it up. 
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MtnDon
Member
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# Posted: 30 Nov 2012 17:34
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They make no noise at all unless they are working hard. Their fan is thermostatically controlled.
Does the guy have the IQ4 attachment or is it a model with the built in IQ?
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buckybuck
Member
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# Posted: 30 Nov 2012 19:06
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Quoting: MtnDon Does the guy have the IQ4 attachment or is it a model with the built in IQ?
It's got a separate smart controller, if that's the same thing as the IQ4 attachment. Is that a good thing or not?
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MtnDon
Member
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# Posted: 30 Nov 2012 20:00
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IQ4 smart controller
Good thing.
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TomChum
Member
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# Posted: 1 Dec 2012 18:53
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Quoting: TomChum I can't say whether the 3500w generator will run it, but how dirty can a generator be?
TMT I think you are referring to problems inverting AC using a crude square wave inverter from a DC source, (then add $$ to clean it up). But the OP wants to know if a brute-force 3500W generator output is "clean" enough to run an (electronic?) charger.
It seems to me that output from any spinning generator would be about as "clean AC" as could be. I don't understand why the Honda & Yamaha call themselves "inverters" when an AC generator should not need to invert AC to get AC.
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MtnDon
Member
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2012 21:27 - Edited by: MtnDon
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Quoting: TomChum I don't understand why the Honda & Yamaha call themselves "inverters" when an AC generator should not need to invert AC to get AC.
An AC generator does not need that. The engine in a normal or standard generator, like most of them out there, turn an AC generator at 3600 to make 60 Hz AC power. The Yamaha and Honda (and other makes) inverter generators do not directly produce AC power.
The engine in an inverter generator turns an alternator similar to what's in your car or truck. That puts out DC power (once past the regulation device). That DC power output is run through an integral inverter to produce the AC power output. Hence it is an inverter generator. The engine has a throttle or control system that varies engine speed with demand. This is possible with a DC output alternator. It is not possible with the standard AC generator as varying the engine speed with them will cause the 60 Hz output to vary. So the engine in the typical AC generator runs at a near constant 3600 RPM. There is a throttle governor control that opens the throttle more when demand increases. The governor mechanism holds the engine speed as close to 3600 RPM's as possible. Many of the governors are not able to maintain the engine speed within a narrow enough range and that causes the output cycles to wander away from 60 Hz. Some electric devices are more sensitive to that than others.
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hitanktank
Member
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2012 22:04
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So does the IOTA smart charger use a 6 guage wire from the battery posts to the charger for charging? It looks like a cool setup because it can also be used as a power source.
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MtnDon
Member
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2012 22:15 - Edited by: MtnDon
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Quoting: hitanktank So does the IOTA smart charger use a 6 guage wire from the battery posts to the charger for charging?
I don't know, and that might vary between models. But I do know that in the past my inquiries were always answered in a very timely manner. Go to their website (link above in my first reply here) ans email a tech rep.
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hitanktank
Member
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2012 22:18
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ok thanks MtnDon
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creeky
Member
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# Posted: 7 Dec 2012 12:31
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I bought a powermax 75 amp. and I will say, search "randy power charger" if you decide to buy one. they have a "boondocker" model.
my powermax worked for three weeks. but never properly. it started at 13.1. then it would give me 13.6. finally it went to 14.1 one day and I realized it would go to 14, before dropping back to 13.6 if I had a heavy load on my inverter at start up.
and then one day I forgot to turn off the generator power switch as I started it and about an hour later my powermax died. ah the scent of burning plastic in the morning!
i got no help from powermax. they told me i needed a PLC and then never responded to any of my messages.
now the good part. I have a "rocket scientist" who lives nearby and when he heard of my troubles he invited me over to have a look at the powermax. made in china. not a good start. but we drilled out the rivets, popped the top off and had a look. a surge protector thingy (it was round, green and thin?) was totally busted. long story short we (er, he) soldered in a 20 am fuse, we reset the adjustable pot to 14.4 and the powermax is working better than ever.
... so if you have a guy knowledgeable in electronics nearby...
personally I would rather have spent the extra hundred bucks on the IOTA and bypassed the headaches.
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buckybuck
Member
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# Posted: 8 Dec 2012 16:14
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I finally got that Iota DLS-45. Now what? I'm assuming the 8-gauge cables I had been using with my whimpy 12-amp charger are no longer going to cut it. What size cable do I need--4 gauge? For convenience, I'd like to use alligator clamps to connect the cables to the battery, but would clamps make a good enough connection for 45 amps?
Also, I read somewhere that there's a way to adjust the output voltage on these (it's at 14.2 with the quick-charge plug plugged in, but I wonder if it might be better to up the voltage a little) by tweaking a pot screw located under a sticker next to the AC cord. The one I got (manufactured in 2006) doesn't have a sticker anywhere near the AC cord. Anybody know where this screw is?
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