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antler
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# Posted: 15 Dec 2012 06:14 - Edited by: antler
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Hi razmichael I read about your hot water setup with the L5 and would like more info please. I'm looking for a way to use an L5 and a 12v pump to have true on demand hot water to two faucets in my cabin! I tried to PM you but can't figure out how, guess this forum doesn't support private messaging.
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razmichael
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# Posted: 15 Dec 2012 10:50
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Hi Antler,
Ask away. many ways to skin a cat depending on needs, source of water power etc. I do not have pictures of the actual setup. At this stage. The diagram here is a simplified view of what I did because you need to determine how you will drain your system, whether you want to add a manual water pump (i did for the sink) and whether you want to use a pressure tank or not. In my case I skipped the pressure tank and used faucets with micro-switches to turn on the pump when needed. The pump can run with its own pressure switch or this can be bypassed. I would have to dig up the actual pump model but I got it with the L5 as a kit - make sure you have a good quality one so you can drive enough water through the L5 to have it start (there are ways to adjust the amount of flow needed). This system is not intended to be used with all faucets going at once. If you need a lot more use then you would likely need a larger pump and a pressure tank. This setup works well for me and my family - some dishes, wash up the kids at night and a rare shower (what is the lake for anyway!). My actual setup is a bit more complicated because I have added a manual foot pump in the kitchen and I also pre filter the lake water into the storage tank. All a bit labor intensive which is another reason why it was designed for limited use.
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antler
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# Posted: 15 Dec 2012 18:38
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Well basically I'll be putting a 40 gallon water tank into the loft. I'll be using a pump to fill it from the pond. My cold water will gravity feed from the tank to kitchen sink, shower, and toilet. I plan on putting an L5 next to the storage tank with hot water to shower and kitchen sink. Every tap will have a low point with valve, so when I leave during the week the lines won't freeze.
I pretty much have it all figured out in my head, I just don't want to have to turn on a pump every time I want hot water. I want to just be able to open the tap and get it. I'd consider the L5 bundle if it makes the system easier to install/operate. How expensive and hard to setup are the taps with micro switches?
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Anonymous
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# Posted: 15 Dec 2012 19:33
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If you don't have enough psi your on demand system will not work. The pilot light will not activate.
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antler
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# Posted: 15 Dec 2012 20:42
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I know that. I'll be using a pump to up pressure on the hot side. I just don't want to manually turn it on when I want water, I want the pump to cut in when I open the taps on its own
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razmichael
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# Posted: 16 Dec 2012 00:09
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The diagram included some examples of faucets with built in switches (check out various marine supply stores for prices). On the other hand you can just as easily wire in a DC switch (even a timer) and "manually" switch on the pump at the sink whenever you want hot water. The PSI from the pump will kick in the L5 and provide hot water. How hard or easy this would be depends a bit on your current wiring but overall not tricky. In my case I ran 12 volts to the pump but used a relay fed from either of the faucets to kick in the relay and power up the pump. I use the pump for both hot and cold water to avoid the need to get water up into a loft (which needs a pump anyway). If you really want to do it this way you should be able to use a single pump with a Y valve and a couple of extra fittings - one way to pump water to the loft, the other way to pump the water to the L5 (depends on the capability of the pump naturally).
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antler
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# Posted: 16 Dec 2012 02:45
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I can do the cold and hot through the pump that wouldn't be a problem. Ths construction hasn't started yet so wiring should be a problem either. I want the holding tank, pump, and L5 unit to be in the loft out of the way. I have a Way figured out to switch back and forth to pull water from the pond or the holding tank. My biggest need/want is having the comfort of the pump cutting in on it's own when a tap is opened. I have pretty much everything else covered with the plumbing/water
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razmichael
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# Posted: 16 Dec 2012 09:41
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Seems to me you have two simple choices - 1, use a pump with a pressure tank which would give you a somewhat standard type of setup. Pump is always powered but comes on when the pressure drops in the tank. Pretty standard house system other than the source. You could split the hot and cold to use gravity for the cold but I don't see the advantage unless you have a power issue and this would make a difference. 2. back to the on-demand system where, when you turn on the tap a microswitch powers the pump (or a relay) and the pump comes on. This is a standard RV or boat type setup (although larger RVs etc use a pressure tank as well). All along I have assumed you are running 12 volts but realized that this may not be the case. In addition you need to consider venting the L5 as these are not specified for indoor use.
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littlesalmon4
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# Posted: 17 Dec 2012 15:26
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You don't actually need faucets with switches. Once the pump is powered it charges the water system and shuts off with is own presure switch. When you open the faucet or turn on the L5 the pump starts and supplies water until the faucet is closed.
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razmichael
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# Posted: 17 Dec 2012 15:30
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Correct - the reason I like to use the switches is that should the system spring a leak it will not then cause the pump to run - likely overkill but as I said at the beginning there are lots of ways to set this up.
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antler
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# Posted: 19 Dec 2012 14:30
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Ok. I didn't know the L5 could use pressure drop to turn the unit on like that. I'll have to try this out with some hoses and faucets before installation, see how it works. Awesome stuff guys thanks!
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razmichael
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# Posted: 19 Dec 2012 16:27
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Minor correction - it is not a pressure drop that kicks in the L5 but a certain flow/pressure difference. When the faucets are closed the pressure on both sides of the L5 are the same with no flow. Open a faucet and that changes.
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antler
Member
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# Posted: 20 Dec 2012 15:45
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Ok thanks for that tip. It should work fine for my setup then. Thanks for all the help guys!
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antler
Member
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# Posted: 10 Jan 2013 03:51
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Another question. There must be some wiring between the pump and the heater unit that switches the pump on right? I'm trying to decide wether I need to buy the L5 bundle, or if I can just use any 12v pump from an rv.
I'd like a setup where I don't need to switch the pump on every time I need water.
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Anonymous
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# Posted: 10 Jan 2013 10:35
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I use a shurflo 12v pump that is close to my water source in my crawl space. I have run a water line to my on demand L10 and then a hot water line to several taps and shower. Whenever one of the taps is opened, the pump turns on, water flows to the L10, it ignites and I have hot water. A bigger pump would allow more than one faucet running at a time but this system works well for me. My pump is 2.8 gpm. Been using this system almost 4 years now with no problems.
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skootamattaschmidty
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# Posted: 10 Jan 2013 10:37
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This pump is cabable of 45psi which is more than enough for the L10 to ignite.
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MtnDon
Member
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# Posted: 10 Jan 2013 10:42
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Quoting: antler There must be some wiring between the pump and the heater unit that switches the pump on right?
The RV pumps have a pressure sensor built in. Pressure is held in the pipes and when a fixture opens that pressure drops which in turn turns on the pump. Close fixture and pump stops. Couldn't be any simpler; no pressure tanks needed.
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antler
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# Posted: 10 Jan 2013 19:12
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Thanks guys! Exactly what I needed to know! Great stuff!
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