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Small Cabin Forum / Off-Grid Living / Insulation and water storage
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Nobadays
Member
# Posted: 3 Dec 2021 08:31
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Last year we had the underside floor of the cabin spray foamed and were pleased that the floors and cabin stayed warmer. We also put a thermometer under the cabin to monitor the temps under there. We were surprised that even in temps as low as -12/-15F under the cabin the coldest we saw was 28F. I had several bottles of beer in a plastic tote under there and they did not break. Why this surprised us is that the cabin is on piers and has just metal roofing as skirting.... fairly well sealed though.

So, a couple weeks ago we had the skirting spray foamed, again ~4" of closed cell. Our temperatures have been abnormally warm this fall.... nights only in the upper teens to mid 20s but the crawlspace has now never dipped below 45F.... mostly stays at 47-48F. I see a new winter water scheme in our future!

Our crawlspace only averages about 24" ... some areas 30" but only on the downhill side and not very much at that. I had asked in an earlier thread about bladders but with the possibility of rodents chewing it.... naw. Found a 300 gallon potable water tank online that is 21"x 48" x 80", perfect.... except $$, about $700 + shipping. But to not worry about frozen water pipes.... breaking ice off the cistern so it doesn't get too thick... worth it!

Next year.... got a deck to finish now before the snow flies in earnest!

Brettny
Member
# Posted: 3 Dec 2021 09:36
Reply 


A back of the truck tank(the ones built for a pickup bed) are prety strong and also come in 300gal versions. I would even consider partially burrying it in your crawl space.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Norwesco-325-Gal-Pick-Up-Truck-Water-Tank-40160/206479631 . They are FDA approved for potable water too.

I have a 210gal I plan to completely burry in our crawl space.

Nobadays
Member
# Posted: 3 Dec 2021 19:23
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Unfortunately, at least the pickup bed tanks I have researched, including this one is too tall to fit where I want to put it. Neighbors have a 550 gal tank under their cabin about half buried... works great.

That said, it is nothing but rock, clay and hard pan under the cabin. I don't have the energy or the money to hire someone to hand dig it.... wish the builder would have thought ahead.

Digging on our property is like a charge in occupation! We dug 6 z 2.5'-3' postholes the other day, started at 8:30am, finished the last hole just before 5pm.... only 30 minute lunch in there... two men digging. Brutal!

Curly
Member
# Posted: 3 Dec 2021 23:11
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Would a livestock tank work for you? You could cover it with a tarp or plywood or a number of other things. They come in multiple sizes and are affordable.
https://www.homedepot.com/s/livestock%2520tank?NCNI-5
You might check farm supply stores. They are full of good stuff like tanks for all sorts of applications.

Nobadays
Member
# Posted: 4 Dec 2021 08:02
Reply 


Curly... good thought! I've looked at a few different tanks at both Tractor Supply and Big R stores, haven't checked the CoOp. Nothing they have online fits my space but.... I will go talk to them before I order the other tank. Never know, they might have access to order in something that meets my specifications and could save me freight at least. Can't see an open top tank under there, even with a make shift lid.... just can't keep the rodents out of the crawlspace. The thought of one getting into our drinking water is not a pleasant one!

Thanks!

gcrank1
Member
# Posted: 4 Dec 2021 10:41 - Edited by: gcrank1
Reply 


Online 'shopping' for plastic or molded containers should be an effective way to find out 'what is out there' (so I know what to look for locally).
I find that browsing gives me ideas for alternate uses or products for my oddball projects.

Brettny
Member
# Posted: 4 Dec 2021 11:34
Reply 


What's the shipping cost on a $700 tank? Even the difference in price on a localy sourced pickup tank vs the $700 one can be given to a younger fellow to dig under the cabin.

Nobadays
Member
# Posted: 4 Dec 2021 15:51
Reply 


Brett.... good point except the "young fellers" who help me out when I need a hand are in their 50's and I know they won't do it. Town is 34 miles away.... Thank you for trying to help find a cheaper alternative!! I do appreciate it.

I am going to ask at the local farm stores as I'm thinking they might have suppliers who have the dimensions/capacity I'm looking for at a better price. Might try the local Amish lumber/hardware store as well.

gcrank1
Member
# Posted: 4 Dec 2021 16:26
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If you have an Amish store you have an Amish community, they hire out around here.

Nobadays
Member
# Posted: 4 Dec 2021 19:12
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I need a low profile tank no more than 22" - 23" but +300 gallons. I hope I can find something cheaper than the 21", $700 tank but if that is all I can find that meets my needs.... buy once, cry once!

gcrank1
Member
# Posted: 4 Dec 2021 19:23
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One big one or two smaller dimensioned ones?

Nobadays
Member
# Posted: 4 Dec 2021 21:28
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Quoting: gcrank1
One big one or two smaller dimensioned ones?


Good point! I need to look at that!

Brettny
Member
# Posted: 5 Dec 2021 15:50
Reply 


The 210gal pickup bed tanks are 29in. I bet two of them from a local store is going to be far cheaper than one 300gal tank in a specialty low profile shape.

Nobadays
Member
# Posted: 5 Dec 2021 17:56
Reply 


Good idea, but alas.... not. Tractor Supply $499.99. Big R supply $384.99. I do have a local business that I can have the tank shipped to and that usually lowers shipping costs. I'm definitely going to go in and talk to them both about what they can get.... and unfortunately 29" is still too high.

I have until spring to see if there is any less costly low profile tanks out there. I'm not horribly concerned about the price anyway, the bladder we were looking at was nearly the same price....we can afford it.

We look to be going to get our first big dump of snow Thursday-Saturday... possibly 10" - 20" that may mean the pickup goes to the main road and track vehicles only, in and out.

Thanks again!

mj1angier
Member
# Posted: 5 Dec 2021 19:27 - Edited by: mj1angier
Reply 


This one might fit your needs
https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200652733_200652733

a few more

https://www.tank-depot.com/productdetails.aspx?part=QI-1014

https://www.tankandbarrel.com/truck-water-hauling-tanks-44233-norwesco-flat-bottom-ut ility-tank-low-profile-300-gallon-p-3591.html?osCsid=3de8eafafb5a470ff3f2739032124ca4

Nobadays
Member
# Posted: 5 Dec 2021 19:46
Reply 


Mj1angier.....ya got me excited! I need at least 300 gallons so I figured 2 of those tanks.... $569.98, then there is shipping... $430.13....$1000.11 I think it would be a wash....

We kind of figure in the $1000 - $1200 range to do it right.

It looks like winter is baring down on us... one more winter with the outdoor cistern... Heat tapes, chipping ice off the tank, possibly frozen pipes to deal with. Regardless of the cost not having to deal with that will be worth every penny!

Brettny
Member
# Posted: 5 Dec 2021 20:15
Reply 


Nobadays where are you located? There are Norwesco yards all over the country, so shipping may not even be needed.

Nobadays
Member
# Posted: 6 Dec 2021 08:35
Reply 


Mj1angier.... good options!

This is the one I was looking at, at Tank Depot: https://www.tank-depot.com/productdetails.aspx?part=A-LP0300-RT But... I just got it to calculate shipping $763, Tax $130..... over $1600 gotta find a different source!

The second link would work as well.... 300gal, $681 + $390 shipping, $1071.... Better... but....

Brett.... we are in South Central Colorado, but great point on Norwesco. There are distributors for Norwesco in both Pueblo and Durango... roughly 3.5 hours to either one. If I can pick the 300 gallon tank up at the distributor without shipping that would be ideal!

I did see in my searches that Tractor Supply sells Norwesco tanks so it might be an option to have them special order it.

Thanks guys!

Brettny
Member
# Posted: 6 Dec 2021 10:07
Reply 


I believe lowes and home depot also sell that brand of tank. Norwesco is a prety much a monopoly in the plastic tank dept

Nobadays
Member
# Posted: 6 Dec 2021 13:33
Reply 


Thanks....

Both of those big box stores are in the same cities. Heck our nearest "big" town Alamosa.... 2 grocery stores and a Walmart is 52 miles away... 23 of that dirt road, rough dirt road. Kind of in the boonies and like it that way!

Nobadays
Member
# Posted: 6 May 2022 21:40
Reply 


Scored big time on hard water tanks for winter use under the cabin! I was at the local CoOp and saw a couple of rectangular pickup water hauling tanks. I had been looking at these because they are only 28" high. The one I was looking at was 305 gallons and cost $645. It is 58"l 60"w30"h (with lid, 28" lid off.)

The ones at the CoOp were smaller measuring 58"l 38"w 28"h without the lid. But, they had 2 of them. So I inquired about the price gand the section manager told me they had been there for years and weren't in the system, so not for sale. I pleaded my case so he tried to call the big boss... no answer. So he said, " I know grossly under priced but give me $100 each and they're yours." Couldn't get my wallet out fast enough!

As near as I can figure as they are odd shaped tanks, they are 195 gallons each, so I'll have nearly 400 gallons of winter water storage under the cabin. Elated!

Now to figure out the best way to tie them together. My thoughts are 2" pipe with a tee between them to add a 1" drain valve and a tee at the second one that I can reduce to 3/4" to feed my pump. I will top fill with a 1" on the furthest tank and vent/overflow with a 1" on the other tank. Both of those lines running to the outside of the cabin. The fill line slightly angled up to drain back to the tank, the vent/overflow slightly angled down to drain out to the outside. Both will be on top the tanks.... the fill on the apex of the curved top, the vent/overflow a little lower on the curved top.

Does that sound right? I've never tried to connect 2 tanks.

Thanks!
IMG_7087_resize_58.j.jpg
IMG_7087_resize_58.j.jpg


gcrank1
Member
# Posted: 6 May 2022 21:55 - Edited by: gcrank1
Reply 


They dont need to be top-filled, a '4 way' fitting at the bottom to join then, one port as the outet/drain and the other as the fill inlet.

Nobadays
Member
# Posted: 6 May 2022 22:17
Reply 


Quoting: gcrank1
They dont need to be top-filled, a


Top fill so no water ever stands in the fill or vent/overflow lines.

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