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Nobadays
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2021 08:31
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Last year we had the underside floor of the cabin spray foamed and were pleased that the floors and cabin stayed warmer. We also put a thermometer under the cabin to monitor the temps under there. We were surprised that even in temps as low as -12/-15F under the cabin the coldest we saw was 28F. I had several bottles of beer in a plastic tote under there and they did not break. Why this surprised us is that the cabin is on piers and has just metal roofing as skirting.... fairly well sealed though.
So, a couple weeks ago we had the skirting spray foamed, again ~4" of closed cell. Our temperatures have been abnormally warm this fall.... nights only in the upper teens to mid 20s but the crawlspace has now never dipped below 45F.... mostly stays at 47-48F. I see a new winter water scheme in our future!
Our crawlspace only averages about 24" ... some areas 30" but only on the downhill side and not very much at that. I had asked in an earlier thread about bladders but with the possibility of rodents chewing it.... naw. Found a 300 gallon potable water tank online that is 21"x 48" x 80", perfect.... except $$, about $700 + shipping. But to not worry about frozen water pipes.... breaking ice off the cistern so it doesn't get too thick... worth it!
Next year.... got a deck to finish now before the snow flies in earnest!
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Brettny
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2021 09:36
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A back of the truck tank(the ones built for a pickup bed) are prety strong and also come in 300gal versions. I would even consider partially burrying it in your crawl space.
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Norwesco-325-Gal-Pick-Up-Truck-Water-Tank-40160/206479631 . They are FDA approved for potable water too.
I have a 210gal I plan to completely burry in our crawl space.
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Nobadays
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2021 19:23
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Unfortunately, at least the pickup bed tanks I have researched, including this one is too tall to fit where I want to put it. Neighbors have a 550 gal tank under their cabin about half buried... works great.
That said, it is nothing but rock, clay and hard pan under the cabin. I don't have the energy or the money to hire someone to hand dig it.... wish the builder would have thought ahead.
Digging on our property is like a charge in occupation! We dug 6 z 2.5'-3' postholes the other day, started at 8:30am, finished the last hole just before 5pm.... only 30 minute lunch in there... two men digging. Brutal!
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Curly
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2021 23:11
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Would a livestock tank work for you? You could cover it with a tarp or plywood or a number of other things. They come in multiple sizes and are affordable.
https://www.homedepot.com/s/livestock%2520tank?NCNI-5
You might check farm supply stores. They are full of good stuff like tanks for all sorts of applications.
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Nobadays
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# Posted: 4 Dec 2021 08:02
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Curly... good thought! I've looked at a few different tanks at both Tractor Supply and Big R stores, haven't checked the CoOp. Nothing they have online fits my space but.... I will go talk to them before I order the other tank. Never know, they might have access to order in something that meets my specifications and could save me freight at least. Can't see an open top tank under there, even with a make shift lid.... just can't keep the rodents out of the crawlspace. The thought of one getting into our drinking water is not a pleasant one!
Thanks!
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gcrank1
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# Posted: 4 Dec 2021 10:41 - Edited by: gcrank1
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Online 'shopping' for plastic or molded containers should be an effective way to find out 'what is out there' (so I know what to look for locally).
I find that browsing gives me ideas for alternate uses or products for my oddball projects.
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Brettny
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# Posted: 4 Dec 2021 11:34
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What's the shipping cost on a $700 tank? Even the difference in price on a localy sourced pickup tank vs the $700 one can be given to a younger fellow to dig under the cabin.
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Nobadays
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# Posted: 4 Dec 2021 15:51
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Brett.... good point except the "young fellers" who help me out when I need a hand are in their 50's and I know they won't do it. Town is 34 miles away.... Thank you for trying to help find a cheaper alternative!! I do appreciate it.
I am going to ask at the local farm stores as I'm thinking they might have suppliers who have the dimensions/capacity I'm looking for at a better price. Might try the local Amish lumber/hardware store as well.
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gcrank1
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# Posted: 4 Dec 2021 16:26
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If you have an Amish store you have an Amish community, they hire out around here.
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Nobadays
Member
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# Posted: 4 Dec 2021 19:12
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I need a low profile tank no more than 22" - 23" but +300 gallons. I hope I can find something cheaper than the 21", $700 tank but if that is all I can find that meets my needs.... buy once, cry once!
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gcrank1
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# Posted: 4 Dec 2021 19:23
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One big one or two smaller dimensioned ones?
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Nobadays
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# Posted: 4 Dec 2021 21:28
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Quoting: gcrank1 One big one or two smaller dimensioned ones?
Good point! I need to look at that!
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Brettny
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# Posted: 5 Dec 2021 15:50
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The 210gal pickup bed tanks are 29in. I bet two of them from a local store is going to be far cheaper than one 300gal tank in a specialty low profile shape.
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Nobadays
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# Posted: 5 Dec 2021 17:56
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Good idea, but alas.... not. Tractor Supply $499.99. Big R supply $384.99. I do have a local business that I can have the tank shipped to and that usually lowers shipping costs. I'm definitely going to go in and talk to them both about what they can get.... and unfortunately 29" is still too high.
I have until spring to see if there is any less costly low profile tanks out there. I'm not horribly concerned about the price anyway, the bladder we were looking at was nearly the same price....we can afford it.
We look to be going to get our first big dump of snow Thursday-Saturday... possibly 10" - 20" that may mean the pickup goes to the main road and track vehicles only, in and out.
Thanks again!
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mj1angier
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# Posted: 5 Dec 2021 19:27 - Edited by: mj1angier
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This one might fit your needs
https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200652733_200652733
a few more
https://www.tank-depot.com/productdetails.aspx?part=QI-1014
https://www.tankandbarrel.com/truck-water-hauling-tanks-44233-norwesco-flat-bottom-ut ility-tank-low-profile-300-gallon-p-3591.html?osCsid=3de8eafafb5a470ff3f2739032124ca4
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Nobadays
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# Posted: 5 Dec 2021 19:46
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Mj1angier.....ya got me excited! I need at least 300 gallons so I figured 2 of those tanks.... $569.98, then there is shipping... $430.13....$1000.11 I think it would be a wash....
We kind of figure in the $1000 - $1200 range to do it right.
It looks like winter is baring down on us... one more winter with the outdoor cistern... Heat tapes, chipping ice off the tank, possibly frozen pipes to deal with. Regardless of the cost not having to deal with that will be worth every penny!
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Brettny
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# Posted: 5 Dec 2021 20:15
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Nobadays where are you located? There are Norwesco yards all over the country, so shipping may not even be needed.
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Nobadays
Member
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# Posted: 6 Dec 2021 08:35
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Mj1angier.... good options!
This is the one I was looking at, at Tank Depot: https://www.tank-depot.com/productdetails.aspx?part=A-LP0300-RT But... I just got it to calculate shipping $763, Tax $130..... over $1600 gotta find a different source!
The second link would work as well.... 300gal, $681 + $390 shipping, $1071.... Better... but....
Brett.... we are in South Central Colorado, but great point on Norwesco. There are distributors for Norwesco in both Pueblo and Durango... roughly 3.5 hours to either one. If I can pick the 300 gallon tank up at the distributor without shipping that would be ideal!
I did see in my searches that Tractor Supply sells Norwesco tanks so it might be an option to have them special order it.
Thanks guys!
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Brettny
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# Posted: 6 Dec 2021 10:07
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I believe lowes and home depot also sell that brand of tank. Norwesco is a prety much a monopoly in the plastic tank dept
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Nobadays
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# Posted: 6 Dec 2021 13:33
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Thanks....
Both of those big box stores are in the same cities. Heck our nearest "big" town Alamosa.... 2 grocery stores and a Walmart is 52 miles away... 23 of that dirt road, rough dirt road. Kind of in the boonies and like it that way!
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Nobadays
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# Posted: 6 May 2022 21:40
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Scored big time on hard water tanks for winter use under the cabin! I was at the local CoOp and saw a couple of rectangular pickup water hauling tanks. I had been looking at these because they are only 28" high. The one I was looking at was 305 gallons and cost $645. It is 58"l 60"w30"h (with lid, 28" lid off.)
The ones at the CoOp were smaller measuring 58"l 38"w 28"h without the lid. But, they had 2 of them. So I inquired about the price gand the section manager told me they had been there for years and weren't in the system, so not for sale. I pleaded my case so he tried to call the big boss... no answer. So he said, " I know grossly under priced but give me $100 each and they're yours." Couldn't get my wallet out fast enough!
As near as I can figure as they are odd shaped tanks, they are 195 gallons each, so I'll have nearly 400 gallons of winter water storage under the cabin. Elated!
Now to figure out the best way to tie them together. My thoughts are 2" pipe with a tee between them to add a 1" drain valve and a tee at the second one that I can reduce to 3/4" to feed my pump. I will top fill with a 1" on the furthest tank and vent/overflow with a 1" on the other tank. Both of those lines running to the outside of the cabin. The fill line slightly angled up to drain back to the tank, the vent/overflow slightly angled down to drain out to the outside. Both will be on top the tanks.... the fill on the apex of the curved top, the vent/overflow a little lower on the curved top.
Does that sound right? I've never tried to connect 2 tanks.
Thanks!
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gcrank1
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# Posted: 6 May 2022 21:55 - Edited by: gcrank1
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They dont need to be top-filled, a '4 way' fitting at the bottom to join then, one port as the outet/drain and the other as the fill inlet.
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Nobadays
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# Posted: 6 May 2022 22:17
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Quoting: gcrank1 They dont need to be top-filled, a
Top fill so no water ever stands in the fill or vent/overflow lines.
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Nobadays
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# Posted: 2 Sep 2022 10:52
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Winter water tank project underway! Tanks all washed out and sanitized. Started 3 days ago digging out and leveling the area where they will sit. As I've said in the past, the ground under the cabin is very hard and rocky, so bought a handheld 18#, 10amp jackhammer from Amazon. It was the ticket! The area needing excavated was 10' x 5' with depths from 4" to 10". I spent nearly 2 hours with the jackhammer hitting every 4" of that area. Then dug for another hour.. What a job... really tore up my arm!
Ended up hiring a couple local guys to help me yesterday to dig the soil out... hauling it one sled load at a time.... level, replace the ground cover and drag the tanks under there. BTW... the tanks are sitting on a sheet of ground contact plywood that was placed on top of the ground cover plastic (old billboard tarp, heavy duty!). Took the three of us 5 hours to excavate and level the pad! Glad that task is completed!
Over the next week or so I'll get it plumbed and the new pump set. Ordered an rv tank monitor and sensors so we can keep track of the water levels without crawling under the cabin.
Stay tuned, more pictures to follow as I get it plumbed and ready for winter! ..... some of the aspens already turning, when did we have summer?
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FishHog
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# Posted: 2 Sep 2022 16:11
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That sure sounds like a hell of a job. Especially with one arm. I give you a lot of credit. I guess you make due with what you have but you seem to do more than most who have both arms
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Nobadays
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# Posted: 2 Sep 2022 17:41
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FishHog... it was a job for sure! I/we do too much working and not enough playing. We've been fishing one time this year... caught a bunch of Kokanee that we smoked up. I keep thinking one day we'll be done with projects but not sure if or when that day will come. Heck I haven't even cut wood yet this year.... storing it vertically in the forests around us, dead standing spruce. I have this year's wood but I try to stay at least a year ahead.
Maybe hiking and fishing next week after the holiday weekend and the city folks go home!
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spencerin
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# Posted: 2 Sep 2022 21:18
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How far is it from the bottom of the floor joists to the ground the tanks are sitting on? I recently thought about doing some similar excavating myself. I was going to use a rotary hammer with a small spade attachment (it's mostly dirt), but decided it was really going to be too much work. You might've breathed life back into my idea. What did you use exactly to sled the dirt out of there?
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Nobadays
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# Posted: 2 Sep 2022 22:57
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These pickup water tanks are 28" high. I figured I needed 36" from the flattened pad to the bottom of the floor joist. Once the tanks were in place it was perfect. I can easily get the lids off and look into the tanks.
I used a snow sled that is about 4' long. We put down cardboard to help it slide out on. It worked quite well. It worked best when the other two guys were there and we could take turns filling, digging and pulling the sled.
I did put the bulkheads in before putting the tanks under the cabin... would have been pretty tough to put them in after putting the tanks under the cabin.
I say go for it! Just be prepared for some intense work! Once the tanks are under you will be glad!
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spencerin
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# Posted: 2 Sep 2022 23:15 - Edited by: spencerin
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I don't know if this is something I really want to tackle! I'm just wanting to create crawlspace access to a quarter of my cabin. It's on a grade, and I can get around underneath all but a quarter it. I'd have to excavate maybe an 8' x 12' area from 0" up to 24" deep. I did the math in my head and figured it would just be too much work for me. But, like I said, you may have given me some inspiration.....
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gcrank1
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# Posted: 3 Sep 2022 20:28
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A hole startes with the first shovel full 
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