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ICC
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# Posted: 21 Oct 2023 14:46 - Edited by: ICC
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My cabin survived the wildfire that hit a few years ago. I started a project to improve the likelihood of surviving another. I never had bushes or shrubs growing close to the perimeter, but there were grasses. So I have eliminated the close to the cabin grasses. Grass was removed with a hoe and a fork in some places. A landscape fabric was put down and some reddish color crushed rock (7/8†max) spread. 1 ton this morning; started early.
It's not a perfect job but it is serviceable. The ground is hard as a rock. I've had a line of 8x16 pavers along the side for years. They were salvaged from a jobsite. They stop rainwater erosion as I have no gutters on there anymore. I added a second row now as they were free salvage I picked up last year in case I found a use for them. The brick walkway was also salvaged pavers (years ago). Concrete blocks sre salvage too. Timbers were all new.
I should actually replace the wood porch with steel to be even better preventatively prepared.
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gcrank1
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# Posted: 21 Oct 2023 19:33
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Now you will probably never get another encroaching fire  but goodonya for the forethought.
We keep kicking things back though with the normal winds we get blowing embers and the roughcut pine sawmill build its probably a tinderbox.
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Brettny
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# Posted: 21 Oct 2023 21:32
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As a northeasterner I dont even see how anything in the picture could catch fire to begin with. Grass like in the first pic will start your cabin on fire?
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ICC
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# Posted: 21 Oct 2023 22:16 - Edited by: ICC
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Quoting: Brettny Grass like in the first pic will start your cabin on fire?
If there is something combustible the hrasses are like kindling.
When the winds blow 60 mph, and the moisture content of dry wood laying on the ground is in the single digits, and the grasses are dry as in not green, wildfires spread like, well, wildfire. Add in that the forests are predominantly conifers (lots of long needle pines) and the ground stays littered with the needles all year unless they are raked up. They burn real good. I use needles to start the fire on the wood stove.
The fire marshall figured that grasses that were growing adjacent to the small shed and the gazebo probably caused those structures to ignite. The gazebo was all wood do it caught easily. The small shed was sided with cement fiber board. However there was a few inches of foundation timbers not covered by cement fiber or metal. That probably caught and to the floor and then the wall framing. The 40 lb propane cylinders in the shed exploded and damaged the side of the metal sided pole barn next to it and that ignited the inside wood wall and roof framing. framing. At least that is how he sees what happened. I had trimmed down all the grassed around the cabin and was lucky that no embers landed on the wood porch. The cabin is covered in metal or cement fiber on the outside. But the porch is wood. I figure better to be cautious. We have had 4 good size fires come within 1.5 miles in 11 years. Then this last one blew right through and burnt all around the cabin. All 4 sides. Keeping the ground clear, no nearby shrubs and short grass saved the day, I believe.
-Izzy
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gcrank1
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# Posted: 21 Oct 2023 22:20
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Wow, that IS thought provoking, Iz 
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ICC
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# Posted: 21 Oct 2023 22:44 - Edited by: ICC
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Just FYI. In a normal year we would rake all the pine needles from around the cabin, gazebo, shed, pole barn and woodshed sometime before the middle of May. Also trim off all the old dry grasses from the year before. Especially after a winter of not much snow and little spring rain. The area around the cabin had been partially cleared. The fire that hit us started earlier in the year than any fires in recent history. Just after mid-April. We figured we had lots of time to complete.
It would be better to not let the grasses grow close by in yhe first place. The pine needles drop every fall/winter and there's not much that can be done to prevent that, other than cut all the trees down. Not doing that.
-Izzy
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paulz
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# Posted: 21 Oct 2023 23:14 - Edited by: paulz
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Good work Izzy. Pass the ibuprofen. Speaking of free pavers..
Back in 2019, a landscaper I met near my city house decided to pack it in and move back to South America. He told me I could have all the pavers in his stock yard, which took me about a dozen trips off and on to get them out to my cabin.
Here is about half, still sitting in the same spot today. The other half I have installed in front of the cabin.
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Steve_S
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# Posted: 22 Oct 2023 08:25
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Gosh, looking at these pics, I think my place would likely terrify most of you...
1) Live Edge cedar siding...
2) 2x 200' Silver Spruces shading the south face of the house (within 20')
3) Tall cedars on the east side, & red pines on the west side.
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Nobadays
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# Posted: 22 Oct 2023 09:36
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Looks great!! We had the Quartz Ridge fire ~15 miles west of us this year.. it's a bit scary when there is ash and chared needles on your windshield each day!
Been doing some of the same firewise work here! Still have the banks each side of the back deck and that lower side to do. Will have to terrace/put Steps down the banks.
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paulz
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# Posted: 22 Oct 2023 09:46
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Quoting: Steve_S Gosh, looking at these pics, I think my place would likely terrify most of you... 1) Live Edge cedar siding... 2) 2x 200' Silver Spruces shading the south face of the house (within 20') 3) Tall cedars on the east side, & red pines on the west side.
Wouldn’t bother me…
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Steve_S
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# Posted: 22 Oct 2023 10:22
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Two Thumbs Up Paul INDEED ! Like me, there is "woosh" potential but if a real fire was headed my way, not a hell of a lot would make a difference. At least there are no shingles in use here, all metal roofs.
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toyota_mdt_tech
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# Posted: 22 Oct 2023 12:39 - Edited by: toyota_mdt_tech
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I was surrounded by fire in 2015, I came up just ahead of the fire, thick smoke, did loads of logging around cabin, cut treeline way back on the west side. I survived. Had a different mindset like ICC now. Next spring, brought in about $10,000 in gravel, gravel doesnt burn. thinned trees around cabin, cut all lower branches off at the 15 foot mark. Nothing flammable near cabin. I have a full foundation.
ICC, gable vents, install a baffle over them, removable types, install during fire season, but allows system to breath, but now allow blowing embers.
Any belt molding on outside or trim above windows, install a small strip of beveled molding to give it a 45 to shed sparks
Hardi board over fascia and if you can, hardi soffit.
ICC, add a cement trim board against cabin wall on deck area, so embers cant roll or pile up and set siding on fire. Spray deck with the fire resistance coating.
Bird block vents, I added a HD metal screen to the inside, the cheap plastic ones can melt with embers of flame. Once embers get into dry attic, away it goes.
In 2019, did the full 40 acre thinning by a professional outfit. ICC, now that you have a perimeter fence, bring in more fencing around cabin, turn horses or goats lose, they will eat the grass down, keep in short, in turn, it remains green, fire will burn up to fence line till it hits short green grass stubble and stop. Grazing animals is perfect. You can loan it out for a few cattle too, free grazing land etc, downfall is the cow poop.
gravel doesnt burn
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standing where container is now
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toyota_mdt_tech
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# Posted: 22 Oct 2023 12:40 - Edited by: toyota_mdt_tech
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Then commercial thinning of all 40 acres, a before and after shot, same location.
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same location after
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greened up in may following year
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ICC
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# Posted: 22 Oct 2023 12:56 - Edited by: ICC
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Quoting: toyota_mdt_tech gravel doesnt burn.
Quoting: toyota_mdt_tech Hardi board over fascia and if you can, hardi soffit
The fascia, soffits and all trim boards are Hardie cement fiber board. The cabin floor overhang along the long sides have galvanized steel flashing material nailed up under the overhang the metal skirting has lots of vent area and all are screened galv steel wire mesh with small openings. (I forget the exact size but they were approved by the fire marshall.) Same thing in the gable end vents. Steel roofing. Looks like your roof is much the same light green color as mine. "Patina green" was the name.
-Izzy
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toyota_mdt_tech
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# Posted: 22 Oct 2023 15:45 - Edited by: toyota_mdt_tech
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Quoting: ICC Looks like your roof is much the same light green color as mine. "Patina green" was the name. -Izzy
Great minds think alike. I picked a color that was closest to tree foliage. Wanted to blend in, not stand out.
Metal Sales was the brand
Western colors 26 gauge in Sierra green. I looked in the eastern colors version, they show Patina green, it is almost the same as mine in color.
As for fires, you have it covered.
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KinAlberta
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# Posted: 22 Oct 2023 20:34
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My understanding is that in many wildfires it’s the blowing embers that are a big threat. My guess is that they must get sucked into the attics or into nooks and crannies in decks etc.
This guide might be helpful:
Home construction | FireSmart Canada
https://firesmartcanada.ca/homeowners/home-construction/
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hattie
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# Posted: 24 Oct 2023 13:51
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Our local Fire Chief did an assessment of our place. She said we need to close in the area under the steps as embers can get in there and ignite.
She also said that if you know a fire is coming, remove all outdoor mats and rugs and bring in outdoor furniture. Close all windows. There is something called W.A.S.P. sprinklers for your roof. They don't look terribly expensive. We may invest in them. Needle trees should have the branches trimmed 6 feet up from the ground.
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gcrank1
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# Posted: 24 Oct 2023 15:56
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My trimmed 35-50+ feet Jack and White pines would go up like mad from a ground fire sweeping through, but they would be crown fired anyway from the dense forest (on two neighbor sides).
We really need what Toy and ICC have done and even then I think our only hope is they stop the fire before it gets here.
Certainly would fast track the question whether to fix the shack up or build new.
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toyota_mdt_tech
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# Posted: 24 Oct 2023 20:55
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Quoting: gcrank1 My trimmed 35-50+ feet Jack and White pines would go up like mad from a ground fire sweeping through, but they would be crown fired anyway from the dense forest...
gcrank1, you will find all states have a program in place to help you manage yuor forest. In my state, the states DNR has a 50/50 cost share program all the time. But then they get grants from the feds to help private small forest owners, they look at us as helpful in ways like providing wood fiber and even is no harvesting is in your plan, you are still providing habitat for wildlife and not to mention, you are carbon negative.
So with these grants, you get get a 75/25, lucky, a 90/10 or even a 100/0.
Cost to treat an acre was about $1,260. I ended up costing me almost $13,000.
What state you in, how many acres you have?
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ICC
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# Posted: 24 Oct 2023 20:57 - Edited by: ICC
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Quoting: hattie something called W.A.S.P. sprinklers for your roof
The WASP stuff can be very useful for setting up as a temporary, as needed, fire protection system, if what you are mentioning is what I think it is. They sell different size kits which include sprinklers that can be mounted to gutters or fascia. The kit includes hoses. You need a pressurized water source.
When we designed and built our new home some ten years ago I included what is known as a deluge sprinkler system on the exterior. Heads are permanently mounted and pipes are used for water. The system is dry until needed. The heads are open at all times and will spray when water is supplied to the system. It does require electrical power to operate the heat sensor system and to start the pump(s), etc., or to initiate a manual turn-on easily. It can also be remotely controlled via the internet. Super deluxe systems can be turned on if satellites sense a nearby wildfire. An anual subscription is needed.
A water supply is needed, of course. We can use water from the rainwater collection cistern system or the well-head which is inside one end of the machine shop and powered by the off-grid solar or backup generator.
I've only test-run the system. It sprays water and soaks everything. Hope it never is needed in real time.
-Izzy
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gcrank1
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# Posted: 24 Oct 2023 21:28 - Edited by: gcrank1
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Toy, we are in Wisconsin, cabin property is 9+ acres.
We had a big drought this year, finally getting rain (good soakers that we need before the ground freezes) but we are still about 6" behind for the year.
I plumb forgot that I should talk to the County Forester and/or the DNR.
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toyota_mdt_tech
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# Posted: 24 Oct 2023 21:38
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Quoting: gcrank1 Toy, we are in Wisconsin
WISCONSIN FOREST LANDOWNER GRANT PROGRAM
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KinAlberta
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# Posted: 27 Oct 2023 23:22
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A video to watch:
Wildfire Embers: How Homes Catch on Fire | Frontline
“Flying embers are the cause of up to 90% of homes destroyed by wildfireâ€
https://www.frontlinewildfire.com/wildfire-news-and-resources/wildfire-embers-how-hom es-catch-on-fire/
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hattie
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# Posted: 28 Oct 2023 17:50
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Quoting: ICC When we designed and built our new home some ten years ago I included what is known as a deluge sprinkler system on the exterior.
That sounds like a great system. We haven't invested in anything yet. Our Fire Chief said that what you want is to raise the humidity around your house with the sprinklers - that is what will save your house. She also said that with all the forest fires now, firefighters have to triage what to save. Houses that appear to have pro-active owners, are usually the ones they go for.
Thank you for the information ICC.
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toyota_mdt_tech
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# Posted: 28 Oct 2023 19:38
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Some high fire areas have an under eave sprinkler system. It can be copper pipes with small spray jets, these spray above and below the eaves and creates a wall of humidity. Also, a good coat of paint or stain to keep siding from igniting easier too.
WASP makes a gutter mount system, also rooftop sprinklers made to set on the peak.
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ICC
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# Posted: 29 Oct 2023 17:06 - Edited by: ICC
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Not part of the firewise project... but the results of the last nearby wildfire. It is always interesting to me to see how the roots can burn way back underground.
-izzy
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gcrank1
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# Posted: 29 Oct 2023 17:40
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Ive read reports that those can burn long and slow, like a super long underground pig roasting only measured in months, iirc.
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ICC
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# Posted: 29 Oct 2023 18:37
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Yes, absolutely. I've seen it myself from winter slash burns we did. The FS here in NM is responsible for a 45,000 acre wildfire spring of '22. It started from a slash burn in Feb with lots of snow on the ground. Smoldered until April when high spring winds whipped it up.
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ICC
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# Posted: 11 Nov 2023 12:49
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Burning some pine needles I raked up from around the cabin. Frosty morning, 24 F, but it will be sunny with a forecast high of 45F. Virtually no wind and the burn is approved by the county fire marshall.
-izzy
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gcrank1
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# Posted: 11 Nov 2023 13:03
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That looks like a Lot of rakin!
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