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paulz
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# Posted: 19 Oct 2023 09:57
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Saw mention of an LP refrigerator in another thread. A new concept to my old city raised brain, but sounds good for the cabin during solar starved days.
You guys use these? Do they have a constant pilot going? Need outside venting? Use much gas?
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gcrank1
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# Posted: 19 Oct 2023 11:03
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IF I had one turn up Id use it (offgrid) as getting LP is cheaper and easier for me than going big with solar-elec.
It is a simple process, as I understand it, and the units seem to live long.
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Brettny
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# Posted: 19 Oct 2023 11:36
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I use to use a cabin that had a propane fridge. Yes they have a constant pilot and this one didnt have venting but that dosnt mean they dont.
They do take about 24hrs to really cool down and that's never useing this in summer.
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FishHog
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# Posted: 19 Oct 2023 12:42
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I've used them for 40 years. They definitely have their place, currently have a 12v fridge and one of my original 2 LP's as a backup or for overflow when we have company.
They can take a while to cool down, never noticed 24hrs, but definitely overnight. Freezers get cold first, then the fridge, so they just need some time. If I show up with frozen food and fill the freezer, the fridge cools much faster, but I never load stuff from the travel cooler until the next day into the fridge.
In the summer I get about 1lb/day LP use. Obviously that fluxuates depending on temp and how much your opening it, but that is a few months average in an Ontario summer with lots of hot days.
If LP is easy for you to get, they are a good solution for longer stays. For a couple days they aren't worth it over a cooler.
Maintenance is simple, I usually just check the burner once a year as the smallest piece of rust sitting on the burner can cause issues. Older units require venting, newer once have CO detectors and can be inside but require repairs if the detectors fail which can be expensive. They seem to last forever, our original one that was old when we got it years ago is still going. It has to be pushing 70 now and still going strong.
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Nobadays
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# Posted: 19 Oct 2023 13:20
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We use an 11cuft Crystal Cold, Amish built propane refrigerator in addition to our Magic Chef 10cuft electric. The propane one is mainly for freezer space and drinks, along with overflow from the electric fridge.
It has run quite well for 3 years now with the only maintenance being to clean/blow out the chimney and burner once a year or so. The tell is when you start having to turn the fridge flame up to maintain the desired temperature... time to clean it. It is not vented though if memory serves any new installations are now going to require venting. Ours is inside (since a bear found it on the porch!) and it goes through a 30# propane tank about every 3 to 4 weeks. A CO monitor is a must!
Like FishHog ours doesn't take 24hrs to cool off but a good 12 - 16 hours. Yes, if the freezer is packed full of frozen food when you arrive, it cools much faster. I agree, for weekend use, probably not but for full time use they are great.
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gcrank1
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# Posted: 19 Oct 2023 14:43
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I didnt realize they were so 'thirsty', a 30# in 3-4 wks seems kind of a bite 
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ICC
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# Posted: 19 Oct 2023 14:48
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I have an old Servel in the cabin. About a pound a day when the cabin is warm. It can be making ice (small tray) within 12 hours of lighting.
I built a false wall behind it. I have a burner exhaust vent to the exterior and a fresh air intake pipe to feed air to the burner. I also have system of hinged panels which allow the heat from the condenser coils on the back to be vented outside or inside, depending on the weather. (Keep heat inside in winter or send the heat outside in warmer weather.)
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gcrank1
Member
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# Posted: 19 Oct 2023 14:54
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Waayyy 'cool' ideas there Iz 
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paulz
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# Posted: 19 Oct 2023 14:57 - Edited by: paulz
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Great info, thanks guys! A quick net search shows prices near 2k for a full size, down to 400 for this RV size, which is the size of our 12V now (looks like it holds a lot in the photos, they must use miniature food lol). A full size would have to be outside.
What’s nice is it’s combo gas and electric, could be switched around depending on battery bank.
https://www.amazon.com/Ecojoy-Propane-Refrigerator-Outdoor-Compact/dp/B0BKKWJ55B/ref= asc_df_B0BKKWJ55B/?tag=smacab-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=632115368848&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvr and=13253483432976865436&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy= 9032109&hvtargid=pla-1927740616750&psc=1
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ICC
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# Posted: 19 Oct 2023 17:56
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That fridge is an absorption fridge, no compressor. On propane, there is a flame that heats the refrigerant and the absorption magic cools the interior of the fridge. When it is operated on electricity the electricity is used to heat a resistance coil to heat the same absorption cycle. Generally speaking use of solar/battery power is an inefficient use of the power.
When an absorption cycle fridge is used in an RV people will often operate it on 12 VDC when driving down the road. The engine alternator makes all the power needed at a negligible cost. When connected to campground power the power use is included in any short-term stays. But if solar is your power source one might want to think twice about using the DC or AC option, unless there is a surplus of solar power.
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gcrank1
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# Posted: 19 Oct 2023 18:42 - Edited by: gcrank1
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Yes, That
I have two absorption models a small truckers travel size and a larger cooler size, they both suck a bat bank well down overnight because they dont really cycle off/on, just a steady draw.
Best results were shutting the power off to the fridge when we went to bed. It wouldnt be opened until morning and held temp pretty well with a folded blanket thrown over. During the day the solar needed to be 'big enough' to recharge the bat bank AND run the fridge. I was marginal with a 600W array.
We went to a Yeti-clone ice chest.
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Fanman
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# Posted: 19 Oct 2023 19:21
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We have a 3-way (propane, AC, DC) fridge (Dometic brand) in our camper. It's pretty anemic, and others have reported the same... but it's over 30 years old. They often struggle in hot weather.
Ours has a standing pilot but some have electronic ignition.
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Brettny
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# Posted: 19 Oct 2023 19:22
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Paul I know your well in the shade but $2k buys alot of solar and solar you can use for other things. Theres plenty of $200 and cheaper mini fridges for sale used. This also dosnt have s reoccurring cost unless you run a generator to charge batteries.
Then you could calculate how many hours you need to run a generator vs how many LBS of propane you would need for a specific time. For a weekend cabin I would almost never do a propane fridge, as every time you show up the batteries should be totally full if the fridge is left off when your gone.
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paulz
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# Posted: 20 Oct 2023 09:45 - Edited by: paulz
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Good morning. Didn’t know there was two fridge designs (compressor and absorption). Sounds like absorption is off the table for me with limited battery charging. I do have 30 260 watt solar panels in service, however as Brett mentioned only a handful are not behind trees at any given time. And generators of course.
Wife and I have been living here 6 days a week, returning to the city house only to collect bills, medical appointments and sit in traffic again, all that fun stuff. Might even sell that house, we’ll see how the winter goes. So an absorption fridge on LP might be OK depending how much gas it uses.
I’ll keep poking around, do they make an RV size compressor fridge? Our 12v is hanging in there, as long as the sun holds out.
Thanks all for chiming in.
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gcrank1
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# Posted: 20 Oct 2023 10:24 - Edited by: gcrank1
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If you want a small fridge look at 'dorm size'; about 4.5cf. They typically have a tiny freezer though, if that is important. The next size up may be around 6.5cf?
Seems to be that the larger ones, especially newer energy star types, use only a smidge more power than the small ones, especially the old small ones (e-hogs).
Quite a few folks have converted a small chest freezer to fridge with the addition of one easy-do control box (Im sure that more info on that will be forthcoming).
If we had to have a fridge I wouldnt mind running the gen about 1hr/day to top up the LFP bats (they charge so quickly with the right charger, as you know there is NO long tail-end charge like with LA).
IE: Employ the KISS Principle as much as possible
For a fridge check with the Habitat for Humanity ReStore and/or the local 'college' when the students leave.
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ICC
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# Posted: 20 Oct 2023 15:15
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There are a number of refrigerators in the 4.5 cu ft size range that use the Danfoss/ SECOP 12 VDC compressor and are about as energy efficient as you can get. That has a soft start variable speed brushless motor.
IndelB, Waeco, Truckfridge Whynter, Dometic, ARB, Edgestar, Ironman, are names to look for. IndelB are assembled in Italy and are sold under many of those other names. Compressors are Chinese built to high standards.
Good explanation and info here... https://www.truckcamperadventure.com/the-danfoss-compessor-refrigerator-pros-cons-and -a-few-tips/
I had a Truckfridge TF49 in a work trailer for about 10 years. It ran fine here in the SW with 360 watts of solar panels on the roof. The freezer would actually freeze stuff. I think they now have a version with a bigger freezer
The Danfoss/SECOP compressor is also available as a parts purchase. Direct from some Cinese sellers. Any refrigeration tech can put refrigerant into it. Two sizes last I looked. They have been used for boat refrigeration where a custom fridge is built into the hull.
Izzy
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zorro
Member
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# Posted: 20 Oct 2023 15:15 - Edited by: zorro
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I have used this fridge for the last 3+ years
I run it off my 3 x 350 panels and 8 x GC bats (supported by a generator if requred)
It takes maybe a couple of hours to cool down when first switched on and the small freezer works really well
But for me, no issues at all and minimum impact on my batteries
https://www.danby.com/en-us/products/compact-refrigerators-en-us/dcr044a2bdd/
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pabear89
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# Posted: 20 Oct 2023 17:01
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I have a 8 cubic foot in the coach, been using while building here in pnw. Key to make it work well is the small fan for air flow across the fins in the back of the unit. It is controlled by a thermostat stuck in the fins on the top of the unit. makes it work less to keep cold, Has a 1-5 setting and if i go above 3 it freezes everything in the fridge compartment.
Fan has low power draw and spark ign for the gas,
A 100 pound tank will last me about 60 days run time.
This also using it for cooking and hot water. If I have to run the heater, gas consumption drops to about 21-27 days.
400w solar panels keep the 4-12v batteries charged with minimal gen run in the winter.
only drawback for using it inside would be venting the backside of the fridge for proper air flow.
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Nobadays
Member
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# Posted: 21 Oct 2023 10:48
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Quoting: pabear89 Key to make it work well is the small fan for air flow across the fins in the back of the unit.
This for an RV fridge! The Dometic in our VW Westfalia was terribly inefficient until I pulled it and put a small 12v computer fan in to blow across the cooling fins, problem solved! Same with the Dometic in our current Pleasure-Way RV. This one I put two computer fans below the fins pointed up to help increase the natural connection. Again, way more efficient cooling.
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gcrank1
Member
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# Posted: 21 Oct 2023 11:06
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Now you have me wondering about a micro fan across the heat exchanger on my absorption 'fridge'?
It may not change the ah's used but being more efficient for said usage cant be a bad thing.
More stuff to mess about with in my otherwise idle moments, lol.
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FishHog
Member
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# Posted: 21 Oct 2023 12:57
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air flow definitely helps, I also put a small fan inside my propane and 12v fridge, as it keeps temps more uniform and avoids the freezing some stuff in the back issue. You can get small rv battery operated fans, or hard wire in a small computer fan.
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pabear89
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# Posted: 21 Oct 2023 13:19
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The fan placement is best located in the vent at the top area. your trying to get air to flow the heat out of the space. They draw very low power and with the thermostat it will cycle off and on as needed.
With absorption cooling, the quicker it cools at the top the more the faster it drops backdown to the burner to be recycled upward to the cooling coil.
Yes the small fan on the inside of the fridge will help, is more of a band aid for cooling inside (have tried it and monitor the temperature)
But the burner will still run longer-term without the external fan.
checking the power draw when the fan cycles it barely shows on the volt meter,
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ICC
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# Posted: 21 Oct 2023 13:44 - Edited by: ICC
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IMO, many RV fridges are poorly installed. As the condenser assembly behind the fridge gets hot that starts the convection circulation of air through, or over, the condenser. Outside air enters via the bottom vent and rises. A fan can assist with the circulation and make for better cooling.
If there is too much space behind the fridge much of the air circulation behind the fridge does not flow through or over the condenser coils. Much air takes the easier path and rises through the too large a gap between the condenser and the RV wall .
Installing a baffle to reduce the space and force all the air to flow through the condenser will help make the fridge cool better. With a fan or without a fan back there.
-Izzy
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ICC
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# Posted: 21 Oct 2023 13:48 - Edited by: ICC
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I've made baffles from sheet foam glued to the wall as well as thin plywood cut to fit and secured to the wall. A stiff but flexible material that will bend a little makes a good bafgle to. It can rest against the condenser.
-Izzy
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Brettny
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# Posted: 21 Oct 2023 21:44
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There are actualy 4.3cuft fridges with separate freezers and thay dont cost a arm and leg. This is mine, the freezer holds 20lbs of ground beef but generaly my frozen water bottles from the cooler and icecream. I run it off 700w of shaded pannels (only get about 3hrs of sun a day) and 6 Gc2 batteries with plenty extra to charge phones, tool batteries and even microwave things.
https://www.bestbuy.com/site/insignia-4-3-cu-ft-mini-fridge-with-top-freezer-stainles s-steel/6173901.p?skuId=6173901&extStoreId=1028&ref=212&loc=1&gclid=CjwKCAjw7c2pBhAZE iwA88pOF1ms8ZcmV_CRRERJJBc9-akloLtQrEgwn7hyncf2rqg6n9kWweQyYBoCYIoQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw. ds
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Brettny
Member
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# Posted: 21 Oct 2023 21:46
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Ops forgot the form is pic specific.
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Nobadays
Member
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# Posted: 21 Oct 2023 22:17
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Quoting: ICC I've made baffles from sheet foam glued to the wall
Did this as well in the Pleasure-Way both to narrow the area to create better convection rise and to insulate the wall from heat caused by sunshine. Definitely helps
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paulz
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# Posted: 21 Oct 2023 23:36
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Quoting: Brettny There are actualy 4.3cuft fridges with separate freezers and thay dont cost a arm and leg. This is mine, the freezer holds 20lbs of ground beef but generaly my frozen water bottles from the cooler and icecream. I run it off 700w of shaded pannels (only get about 3hrs of sun a day) and 6 Gc2 batteries with plenty extra to charge phones, tool batteries and even microwave things.
Nice unit, about the size I need too, and cheap. Absorption I take it, but not a power hog at 1.5 amps, about what I use now.
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ICC
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# Posted: 21 Oct 2023 23:56
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I believe it would be a compressor type. Guessing that because absorption types don't do very well above 95 F degrees and the specs say max temp of 110 F.
1.5 amps at 115 volts AC.
Looks nice. Good to have decent size freezer with separate door.
-Izzy
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Brettny
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# Posted: 22 Oct 2023 07:22
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It's got a compressor. I picked it up for $20 off marketplace a few years ago.
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