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Small Cabin Forum / Off-Grid Living / Valence LiBattery
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Steve_S
Member
# Posted: 2 Jan 2021 09:34
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The Ailia or Drok monitors are ok but they are not "super accurate". The higher end ones like Victron and that level are more accurate.

DMM/DVOM = PITA.
I have 4, each has an opinion of it's own.

I even have a YR Battery tester which is .0000 accurate, so I have a better "feeling for that. Luckily I can use it to read a voltage & use it as a baseline against the DMM's.

You will find that getting an accurate 3.decimal place DMM is hard unless you fork out the cash.
Fluke 87 or 115, Uni-T 61E, Klein meters are known good.

This one and it's little brother the MM400 are quite well thought of, and quite well priced too.
https://www.amazon.com/Multimeter-Auto-Ranging-Klein-Tools-MM600/dp/B018CLOSTC/ref=ps dc_14244471_t2_B018EXZO8M

Hope it helps

paulz
Member
# Posted: 2 Jan 2021 10:41
Reply 


Thanks Steve. What I'd really like is one of those clamp on meters so I can test amps easily too.

Today when I get back to the city I need to get one of those MeanWells hooked up for charging. I suppose I will attempt to adjust it under an indicated 14.6 to be safe. Do I just adjust it with the meter hooked up, no load?

gcrank1
Member
# Posted: 2 Jan 2021 12:43
Reply 


Iirc Ive been seeing things posted about LFP bats being best at their 80%, and I think that was the 'middle 80%'; ie, 10% off the bottom/10% off the top.
Does this mean charge 'em to 90%soc?

paulz
Member
# Posted: 2 Jan 2021 19:12 - Edited by: paulz
Reply 


Pulled out one of my new MeanWell power supplies to recharge the Valence batteries after my cabin trip. I'm unclear on the 115 AC terminal inputs, marked L, N and FG. How does that correspond to my regular house AC, do I need to find which is the white and black?

They didn't come with instructions, probably expect you to know what you're doing.. The DC side I understand, + and -.

Edit: I should add that this box is 115 or 230 AC, there is a switch to go between.
dfs.JPG
dfs.JPG


ICC
Member
# Posted: 2 Jan 2021 20:02 - Edited by: ICC
Reply 


Meanwell has a website that should have info relating to all their products.

L should be :"Line", the hot wire (black) in a 110-120 VAC power line. Sometimes called the unearthed conductor

N should be Neutral, the white or grey. Sometimes called the earthed conductor as it is expected that the white/grey will be connected to the earth (ground) at the service panel.

FG should be the green/bare ground. This is sometimes labeled PE on some Asian brands.

ICC
Member
# Posted: 2 Jan 2021 20:08
Reply 


Quoting: gcrank1
Iirc Ive been seeing things posted about LFP bats being best at their 80%, and I think that was the 'middle 80%'; ie, 10% off the bottom/10% off the top.
Does this mean charge 'em to 90%soc?


The lifetime (measured in complete discharge/discharge cycles) will be extended if the LFP (and other lithium chemistry batteries) are never fully charged or fully discharged. However, the LFP will still greatly outlast any lead-acid battery and still give you more energy over time, for the price.

I did oversize my bank of GBS brand prismatic LFP cells when I bought them. Several of us went together on a bulk purchase from China, a very good deal. After many months of tracking my use I limit the charge of my LFP bank of GBS cells to go no higher than approximately 75% maximum unless I have plans to do more than the usual amount of workshop use. In normal day to day use, they seldom drop to less than 45% charge. I expect them to last a long time. Of course, I could have saved money by buying smaller cells. Trade offs are a personal choice.

If I plan ahead properly, I boost the charge level to 95 to 100% a day or so ahead of planned extensive shop machinery use. I hate to run the generator unless that need coincides with the monthly maintenance run.

I do similar with my laptop. Normally when just being used at home I run the battery between 60 to 75% minimum/maximum with the on board battery minder software. When I have a planned trip I fully charge the day before.

I have hacked chargers for my cordless tools. The charge is stopped at 80% for normal use around home. When I know I am heading off someplace for remote work I do a full charge.

paulz
Member
# Posted: 2 Jan 2021 20:11
Reply 


Thanks ICC. All I've found in the data sheet Steve mentioned earlier, don't see the AC part.

https://www.mouser.com/datasheet/2/260/scn-600-spec-1180098.pdf

Anyway, I think that's all I really needed to know. And I think my white wire is grounded at the panel. Is there a way I can verify/measure at the socket, or just pull the face plate off and look?

ICC
Member
# Posted: 2 Jan 2021 21:17
Reply 


Quoting: paulz
Is there a way I can verify/measure at the socket, or just pull the face plate off and look?


Not really. Fluke makes a couple of meters that do that test accurately. Expensive, as in $2K. It can be done with other quality multimeters along with a high current draw device like a hair dryer. However, that is best left to someone who is quite familiar with circuits and power.

DIY'ers look in the service panel and verify.

Steve_S
Member
# Posted: 3 Jan 2021 01:00
Reply 


Manuals & Docs for Meanwell PowerSupplies here:
https://www.meanwell.com/productSeries.aspx#

Attached is a PDF file on LFP Prismatic Cells. You may find it useful.
Luyuan_Tech_Basic_Li.pdfAttached file: Luyuan_Tech_Basic_Li.pdf
 


paulz
Member
# Posted: 3 Jan 2021 12:27 - Edited by: paulz
Reply 


I don't see mine (SCN series) anywhere on the MeanWell site, not in the discontinued or anywhere else. Maybe I'm missing it. Not important I don't think, my plan is to just hook up the AC, a DVM to the output and adjust the voltage to low 14s, and put it on the batteries. Just doing a few odds and ends first while I gather up the courage. That's a lot of amps for me. The Ailia meter is on these batteries so I should be able to watch the Vs and the As.

Quoting: ICC
DIY'ers look in the service panel and verify.


Yes the white is grounded at my panel. And, as you know, the black goes to the smaller prong on the outlet and white to the larger. My house is a 70 year old mess, hopefully nothing got switched between the panel and outlet. And I don't know if the green is in place all the way. AC stuff I'm used to doesn't care about polarity, or the green. Apparently they are important on this thing. I may be giving myself a new hairdo in a few hours..

ICC
Member
# Posted: 3 Jan 2021 13:30 - Edited by: ICC
Reply 


Quoting: paulz
white to the larger.

White to wide

Quoting: paulz
My house is a 70 year old mess, hopefully nothing got switched between the panel and outlet. And I don't know if the green is in place all the way

Separate ground wires were introduced in the 60's. And by now nobody has a clue what is what in any home older than that.

You should have one of those little plugin ground/fault testers.

In the old family home that dated from the 1850's Dad marked all the outlets with glued on tags if they did not have a proper ground.

gcrank1
Member
# Posted: 3 Jan 2021 13:37
Reply 


White to Wide
Oh, that makes just too much good sense.
My logic, such as it is, keeps trying to tell me the 'power wire' should have the biggest spade....I think I might remember your memory device there

paulz
Member
# Posted: 3 Jan 2021 13:59
Reply 


Wide to white...dang that's good.

Well I'm off and charging, after taking apart several outlets, buried in corners, to make sure it was right. Set the PS to 14.4, plugged it in and ran for cover.

Only charging 9 amps. Indicated voltage is 13.28, SOC 60% fwiw.

Is the battery impedance limited the amps?
20210103_105031_resi.jpg
20210103_105031_resi.jpg


paulz
Member
# Posted: 3 Jan 2021 20:27
Reply 


So, 6 hours later, voltage is 13.38, amps at 7. Should it get into the 14 volts ever? SOC has gone from 60 to 80.

I was expecting higher amps and faster charge, what could be the problem? I do have fairly small gauge wire from PS to battery, about 15ft. of 12g wire, and a 50' cord reel going to the PS from the garage. But none of it is hot.

paulz
Member
# Posted: 4 Jan 2021 21:41
Reply 


8 hours on the charger today, it's at 14.50 volts, still charging at 2amps. So I guess that's pretty good.

paulz
Member
# Posted: 5 Jan 2021 11:11
Reply 


14.1 this morning after sitting off the charger overnight.

paulz
Member
# Posted: 10 Jan 2021 15:55
Reply 


Looks like my support crew went on strike for better working conditions.

Got back from the cabin yesterday, batteries at 13.1, 60%SOC. Charger started at 8 amps. Now they are at 14.5v and charging at .5 amps.

So I still don't get the 2nd stage of charging, do I leave it at a half amp now and hope the voltage stays at 14.5 or call it good?

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